I'm having a personal dilemma that I'm hoping someone can help with. I have a lovely elderly cat, that has some sort of bladder or kidney problem. After spending over $700 on labwork, exrays, meds, etc., we still don't have any changes. In fact she's now deficating all over the house (guess the litter box is a pain-trigger), and throwing-up on all the furniture (which is all brand new...). The vet wants to do more lab work etc. and I'm feeling reluctant to spend a bunch more money with no guarantee of resolving the problem.

So, I'm struggling..........I want to do what's right for the cat.......but I'm really not so sure what is right. The thought of having her put to sleep crossed my mind more than once. However, I'm not sure whether that's to put myself out of my temporary misery over the ruination of my carpets and furniture.....or if it's for the ultimate relief of suffering for my cat whom I love dearly. My cat does not seem to be suffering, however the vet thinks she is, as she has evidence of advanced arthritis on her exrays, and the fact that she's avoiding her litterbox is indicative of her associating pain with using it.

Tom.... or anyone who wants to answer, would taking a life make you devolve????? I'm guessing you would all say it's dependent on the situation and the reason. Being completely honest with myself, I know that my intent would be more to restore harmony to my home. I'm not convinced my cat is suffering near as much as I am! Watching her ruin my expensive new furniture is hard to endure. Yes, I know.......I'm shallow!

I've done a quick read of the trilogy a couple of years ago....and it wasn't sinking in at the time. I'm back at it for the 2nd read, and almost finished book 1. I've spent the last several months on this forum reading and learning, and it helps the book make more sense. I'm not sure if the topic of euthanasia was covered in the book. So many thanks to all of you!

debbjer: would taking a life make you devolve????? I'm guessing you would all say it's dependent on the situation and the reason.

Tom: Your guess is right. The cat lives at your pleasure. You have a tough choice but the larger lesson is to do what is in your core -- to accurately express what you really would like to do, as opposed to doing what your intellect thinks is the right thing. Then you must live with that decision gracefully, without guilt or angst, accepting how it plays out learning what you can from the aftermath (feedback -- hind sight that will trickle in perhaps for a long time. Act boldly and decisively from the core of your being honestly reflecting who you are, not how you think you should be, make instant peace with the decision, and learn what you can from how it plays out.

This is a good template for all your decisions -- it takes courage to be who you are and accept that you might make mistakes. It also optimizes your opportunity to learn and grow.

Tom C

WOW Tom..................that's DEEP!!

In reading your words, I realized (sadly) that I've spent the majority of my life wanting to do "the right thing" for the approval from myself and others for doing it! When I'm not sure what the right thing is, I'm inclined to seek the answer outside, rather than internally. I'm also coming to the realization that perhaps I do this to avoid taking responsibility for any ensuing unpleasantness from my choice. It's easier to tell myself that someone else thought I should do something, and so I did it....rather than fully accepting my own decision to do whatever I do, and fully accept and embrace all the lessons that come with my own decisions. More often than not, even tho I WANT to do the "right" thing, I do whatever the hell I want.....and then pretend I don't care what others think. If I can find someone who agrees with what I want to do, I feel much better about doing it. How sad and ridiculous, and what a waste of time and energy!!!! The games we play are sometimes so hard to see,...until we do. I'm always amazed when I find myself all caught up in a game, and wonder how I missed it. It seems so glaringly obvious once I see it.

Your advice is perfect Tom, and it resonates right to the core of my being. I should have known on some level, that none of this has anything to do with the cat!

with much appreciation for who you are, and what you share, and for unknowingly (or knowingly) point out a rather large game that I've been playing for way too long! Time to take off my blinders (again)!
Debbie

Hi debbjer
Tom is deep, isn't he. I'm sorry your cat is having trouble, it doesn't sound like much fun for anyone. I put a cat to sleep way too late for the cats best interests because of my own selfish interests. Once it was done I could see the difference immediately when that pain energy was allowed to go. You say pain at least once in your post so I picked up on it. It's hard, and then it feels better. I almost felt more grown up having to make such a decision, and then being strong for my daughter during it. It's a little bit about the cat. I love cats. Be good to yourself too debbjer.
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

Thanks Bette;

The struggle for me, is that I LOVE the cat, but I WANT to put it down.....for my own selfish reasons, but can't bring myself to do it yet. I had a big talk with her this morning, and told her if she didn't quit messing everywhere she was going to go reside in NPMR cat heaven and would be welcomed back with a new furry healthy body. She purred loudly and thought it was a mighty fine idea.......she's so damned happy, and TRUSTING. Maybe she'll just recover and we'll all live happily ever after. I'm going to tolerate it until I no longer am willing to.....and then I'll kiss her goodbye and ask the vet to do the big sleep. That day might come tomorrow, or it might be years from now........I just don't know.

Hopefully, my beloved husband doesn't get ill...... I keep thinking about that, and wondering what the hell is the difference??? Why do we think it's okay to "off" our pets when they're old and ill and suffering, but not our parents or our spouses??

My dad suffered long and miserably with MS and then cancer......my step-mother suffered FAR more than he did with all the resistance she felt taking care of him....but it was the "right" thing to do she said. When he died.....she felt nothing but relief. There was no missing him, grieving for the loss, etc. She was just relieved. We all were.......relieved. Who he was, no longer lived in his physical body. There was just a personality that was moody, mean and cranky, and didn't appreciate anything or anyone. We were all relieved at the end. I refused to pretend otherwise. Many of the family pretended otherwise, but admitted eventually to the relief and lack of grief.

I don't have a lot of issues with death.......it's part of life.
I might have some issues with ending a life......but then again, what's the difference in fast or slow? Would anyone or anything be served by waiting until it occurs naturally? Would that mean I loved more, or was a better person? Deep thoughts!

Debbie

You are welcome Debbie, and thank you for the conversation. That the thing about pets, well one of the things, they understand coming back (I believe) and do several times within one human lifetime. Pets are how we learn about love and how to love, sometimes the only way for some. Maybe they are also how we experience death to learn from it, here as loved ones partially for that reason too. You'll make the right choice when the right time comes, or possibly be left out of the process as the choice is made for you, again when the time comes. The cool thing is that you're thinking about all these things, I think. Bye for now.
Oh yeah, I meant to add, fall down seven times, get up eight. Buddhist I think.
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

Debbie: Hopefully, my beloved husband doesn't get ill...... I keep thinking about that, and wondering what the hell is the difference??? Why do we think it's okay to "off" our pets when they're old and ill and suffering, but not our parents or our spouses??

Tom: From a personal perspective, the difference is primarily our pervasive fear of our own death -- and, of course the many forms of fear: pride, belief, wants, needs, arrogance, and ego. From a sociological perspective, the problem is the fear of abuse, that is, the fear of having to deal with those who would game the system (for easy profit, or out of dire circumstances and great need) - particularly as such abuse might pertain to oneself when one is old and vulnerable). Typically, there are those who will gain financially or materially from prolonging or ending the life of another - and generally they are the ones who now make the decision whether or not to pull the plug (loved ones, doctors, hospitals, insurance companies, and lately add politicians and tax collectors to that list). These difficulties have acceptable solutions in law, process, and procedure that could be reasonably implemented, but the personal fear and distrust is so strong within our culture that we refuse to consider alternatives to the status quo.

Everyone judges the average quality of others in terms of the quality of themselves - and, when they do that calculation, the result is terrifying. No way are they going to early-on trust their survival to relatives and others in some unknown future situation, much less to some bureaucratic process or procedure. By the time they want to change their mind it is too late or they are too scared.


Tom C

Hi Debbie.

My wife and I just went through the same thing with our cat last fall. She was a regal old cat, 18 years old. I don't think there is any one answer or way that we should handle these things. Tom's answer is the best, it must reflect who you are, not who you present to the world. We never really can fool ourselves even when we come up with all good reasons to justify our actions. I don't have a right answer for you either. I can tell the story of how we handled it and why. It wasn't the right way for everyone or the easy way, but it was right for us. This is just the story of the passing of our cat.

Spot was 18 years old and in her last few months she was much the same as your cat. Messes everywhere and lots of cleaning up. My wife is a nurse and knew her kidneys were failing, causing toxic buildup in her small body. She eventually had like a seizure and was very weak and my wife and I had a long talk about what to do for her. She knew Spot was dieing and the vet would only slow it down or end it if that was her choice. Spot was her cat from long before we met and I told her whatever she decided I would support her. Taking care of people at the end of their life is a big part of her job at the hospital and I wanted her to choose from her heart.

Her answer was that Spot was part of our family and as long as she wasn't in pain she should die at home with us who loved her. I accepted this and we took great care of our little queen. We cleaned up and steamed carpets and furniture, never scolding her and keeping her comfortable and loved. She rallied back a bit for almost a month and never seemed to be in pain, just confused as to why her body wouldn't obey her anymore. Finally the day came when I got home in the morning and Spot couldn't get up to greet me. I work nights and my wife works days, so I tended to her all that day, keeping her warm and comfortable as possible as she slipped away. I laid on the floor stroking her and talking like I would to an old friend so she wouldn't be alone.

That evening she died at my feet while I was reading our message board. I prepared her place in the back yard, called work and said I'd be a late and why, then met my wife when she got home. She said her goodbyes and we laid Spot to rest, then I went to work. My wife was very comforted by the way it all ended. It was hard for her to say goodbye, but Spot died as my wife would wish for any of her family, surrounded by love and not alone. As endings go it was good. It was right for us and I think right for Spot. She died with dignity and respect. If she had been suffering (and I would have known) we would have had her put to sleep with the same dignity and respect with us there holding her.

There is no one answer that works for everyone. We each must judge from our own heart and experience. That it is your choice is what matters. Your story moved me to write this and I hope you find the right answer for you. I just wanted to share, not judge or recommend in any way. We have been in your shoes and know what it is like. You will do fine.

_________________
always, John

Thanks John....your story was moving. Spot picked the perfect family to experience PMR with.

I have made up my mind, and have decided that as long as she doesn't appear to be in pain (i.e. she's not crying or flinching etc., and is still "herself"), we will leave things as they are. I'm not taking her back to the vet for more tests, meds etc., and so she will either get better or worse......and I'll make a decision that feels right when the time comes.

I was struggling with the whole "right to life" concept, and all the input I've had from this forum has been really helpful.

thanks again for taking the time to share your experience......I admire both you and your wife for your patience and love. In our own situation, I still question the idea of "pro-longing" the inevitable. For now, the messes have stopped.....so I'm feeling far more optimistic.

Debbie you found the perfect way to say what I was struggling (a little) to say to John about this post without luck coming in, as how lucky John, his Wife, Spot and various combinations of them are (were and will be) to be in that circle of love. Your choice seems like a loving plan.

John, you are love.
Love to you and yours
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

Thanks Debbie and Bette. I was compelled to write that all out. Its never easy to choose these things and whatever your choices let them be good.

_________________
always, John