Are there methods that can be used to help get your guides' attention ?

I've been meditating for 2.5 months now and I sometimes wonder if my guides are paying attention to me or if I'm just not paying attention to them. Sometimes I get the impression that they're sitting around drinking coffee and playing poker and once in a while, they'll notice me trying to communicate with them and when they do they might sometimes toss me a little cryptic bone to keep me quiet. I'm probably just too impatient - I understand that 2.5 months is not a long time.

I recall a few times in my life when I really felt that my guide (or guides) were communicating with me and felt much more connected. Lately, I feel like I'm on my own.

I guess when you spend a good part of your life not paying them much attention, it's pretty selfish to expect them to respond to your every beck and call once you decide you're ready ?

Carle

Carle,

As you say: 2.5 months is not a long time.

They are not there to do things for you or engage you in conversation. They are there to help provide specifically needed growth opportunities, valuable learning experiences, and nudge you in the right direction. If talking to you does not accomplish one of those three goals, they are not interested. They anticipate how their interaction with you might affect you and make their decisions accordingly. Many guides care little about what you process with your intellect -- they know the intellect is generally in service to the ego and has little effect upon long term entropy reduction.

Some guides feel working with the intellect is a waste of time -- others do not -- there is data to support both sides of that long simmering argument.

Tom C

That's a fascinating insight into the varied 'personalities' and attitudes of guides, Tom.

Thinking of intellect, is it purely a PMR attribute, or can some aspect of it be present in NPMR also? The idea of a 'simmering' debate amongst guides about the pros and cons of working with the intellects of their 'clients' (for want of a better word!) perhaps implies some intellectual side to the guides also?

Arthur

_________________
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."

My pre-MBT understanding was that everything was intelligent energy, intelligence is different than intellect though, isn't it? Intellect does ring of PMR and ego to me (too?), unlike intelligence that I associate with consciousness and organizing data per MBT.
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

Arthur,

The intellect exists within all awareness in all reality frames -- and is primarily the servant of ego in most of them.

However, in the highly constrained PMR frames where "I" appears to exist at the center of existence separated from, and set to struggle in competition with, all else ("me" pitted against the universe of "not me" in an interactive game of survival and accumulation of self-referential power and control) the intellect's connection to and awareness of the core of one's being is especially tenuous. In Western cultures (in both the East and West) the intellect is more subservient and tightly bound to the ego because the sense of separation from the whole of existence is more intense and pervasive. Thus, dealing with a self-focused left brained intellect in order to affect the quality of consciousness typically generates little traction for change. Somewhat like trying to move an object by pushing (as opposed to pulling) on a string connected to the object.

On the other hand, some individuals, with good right brain - left brain balance who live in fuller awareness of the larger reality, have a stronger connection between their intellects and their inner being. With these, a guide might well facilitate growth more quickly by employing intellectual engagement.

Guides who chose to work more overtly and who engage intellectually with their charges must work much harder, be more creative, clever, attentive and focused, and be constantly aware of the risk of digging themselves and their client into a hole by feeding the ego which leaves their client worse off than before they started. They tend to be "hands on" and more assertive type individuals. Such proactive guides produce by far the best positive results (highest learning rates) but also produce the highest percentage of negative results. Some proactive guides (it's an art more than a science) consistently produce great results, others, not as gifted or as inclined to take risks, opt for the more conservative slow but steady route. Guides are allowed to interact in the way they think is best for them and their charge. Matching a guides approach with the personality and potential growth rate of his/her charge is key. Sometimes serious mismatches occur leading to problems of devolution or the stunting of potential growth. If a mismatch is pointed out, the system tries to accommodate but consistently effective pro-active guides are usually in short supply. Those guides who use opposite approaches sometimes look askance at each other -- it is an ongoing debate with some tension and occasional strong feelings on both sides.

Tom C

Thank you Tom, for such a wonderfully detailed account of guides and how they operate. I shall print that off. Where else but here could such 'insider' info be found?

I hope my guides are taking note!

Arthur

_________________
"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."

All,

Remember, the concept of individual "guides" is our metaphor, i.e., our model for describing the individuated learning support feature, structure, and function of the larger consciousness reality system. The information I gave above is my interpretation of my direct experience and interaction with many guides besides my own and with my direct experience and interaction with the system that manages and controls this particular learning support function.

Our vision of a team of humanoid "people" individually assigned and hovering over us 24x7 to help facilitate our entropy reduction (our spiritual growth, consciousness evolution) is produced by us overlaying our PMR conceptual habits onto the causality of NPMR. We must model things in a way that makes sense to us from a PMR perspective so we can talk about it using PMR language. Do not assume that the larger reality is constrained by our limited perspective just because we are. Again, don't confuse reality with the model of reality.

Tom C

Hi Tom, thank you, as always. Yes, do not confuse the model, it is something worth repeating and requiring you repeat often to keep us on track. The more I learn of MBT the more understanding I get of my own longstanding concept of reincarnation, picking our family, and that we are here to exchange pieces of our puzzles with others. It is the computation and PSI uncertainty aspect of MBT that allows how all the details could possibly work out. Before MBT I just believed, now I understand at least as far as I now understand anyway.
Love to you and yours
from me and mine ;)

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

"The menu is not the meal" Alan Watts

I do one of Seth's exercises almost every day. This is not another meditation technique and it does not take you to OBE. It gives you an opportunity to listen to you inner voice, or may be to contact your guides.


I believe that during this exercise I am able to talk to my guides. There are not any voices in my ears, and I am perfectly aware of my surroundings. One can call it a border state, my awareness is here, but not completely, and there, but not completely as well. Our conversation is a two or more streams of thoughts. I almost always know when it is not my thought going through my mind. They never gave me the Big Secret, or I never had a revelation or awakening, as you can find it in the books. This is going on for two years now, and I have two big notebooks of notes. It could be a thought, guidance, support or, once in a while they are playfully teasing me. Very often I can see a short story, most of the time it is allegorical, so guide will ask, if I was able to understand it. Unfortunately I very seldom do, and then guide will give me a brief explanation of what was presented to me. And I laugh or cry, but it does not bring me back to reality of my bedroom.

I hope that this exercise can help somebody, as it did help me. I have not become a much better person on my entropy has not been significantly reduced. What I have is a state of slow becoming, and if I get lazy to do this exercise for a couple of month, I am aware of what I am missing.

_________________
'Real knowledge is to know the extent of ones ignorance.' Confucius.

Tom,

In the narrow field of conceptualizing, would it be far out to approximate the "Guides" metaphor with maybe an "Event Programmer" of sorts?

Example:

FWAU gaily frolics through the Black Forest.

Guide plops an EVENT within FAWU's individual data stream.

FAWU interacts with EVENT.

FAWU makes choice.

Results and outcomes rue the day. The scales dip.

(Randomness variable excluded)

_________________
"It's just data."

http://lifeisavideogamethemovie.com
https://www.facebook.com/LifeIsAVideoGameTheMovie

Lena,

That is an excellent exercise -- meditation without the usual process tools -- same result. and you learn that "deep and fogy" is not necessary.


edge: "...an "Event Programmer" of sorts?" gooey

Tom: Yes, an event programmer, a nudger, and an invisible guiding presence -- all that works. An even better, more concise, description: The concept of "guides" is a metaphor for an individual PMR User Interface to the larger Consciousness system. .... a CUI . pronounced cooey.

From the perspective of NPMR your virtual Physical body is a PUI (pooey) (as mentioned in MBT). From the opposite perspective -- the perspective of your body, your guides, higher self, intuition, meditation, OOBE, etc. represent different CUIs. One you are more familiar with: You interface with the internal complexities and interaction of your computer through a GUI (gooey). Same idea.

Tom C

Thank you Lena. It was one of the most exciting times when my scholarly research found creating our own reality supported scientifically.

Edge, other than the time I could have died and didn't (that I know of), I 'feel' my guides as information. The times I feel I was physically moved out of harms way I feel/felt my guides were more of beings, but most of the time, now that I am a little more aware, it is bits of information or my sitting and listening to something I might not have that ends up important. It's almost as if I look at the information as the guidance involved rather than to a being or specific situation being set up. Well, now that I say that I have to take it back. Never mind, I was talking out of my neck rather than my intellect. Situations are constantly set-up, the choice I am usually faced with is attend or don't attend. I usually pick don't attend though, or as the young people say, I flake out. Not real good for changing things, not bringing in new variables. Maybe the guides are in the randomness.
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

Would they initially work to reduce the ego of their client, so that intellectual engagement would be more profitable?

Indeed they might -- if that seemed like a a promising path.

Tom C