In MBT termanology?

How to explain what information is to someone unaware of MBT?

I was explaining to them that consciousness is a non-physical interactive information system and they asked me what I meant by information. I have no clue how to answer that. We are discussing why people think that the brain creates consciousness...any articles on that subject or against it would be great! Thanks

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I eat ego's for breakfast!
Sincerely, Ego.

Information is the meaning, the content, and the knowledge of the message being communicated. It is inherently non-physical - you can't touch information.

Data is the media, the code symbols (like words on a page) of the message being communicated. It is physical, although our notions of what "physical" means in MBT changes depending on the audience.

You need a consciousness in order to extract information from data. That is why consciousness can be described as a non-physical (you can't touch consciousness) interactive (communication) information (you need a consciousness to have information communicated, and you can't touch it) system (many interacting pieces of consciousness communicating).

I think Tom discusses how information is non-physical here: http://vimeo.com/11005286 - among other videos, posts, and the book.

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Mike

So how do I explain to someone what the MBT definition of consciousness is, if they have a differen't definition of consciousness themselves? Im kind of stumped besides saying it is a non physical interactive information system...

_________________
I eat ego's for breakfast!
Sincerely, Ego.

Give them a link to the book? http://books.google.com/books?id=6To090 ... &q&f=false
Love
Bette

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All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

I want to explain it without making them read the book...

_________________
I eat ego's for breakfast!
Sincerely, Ego.

Try using the idea that dreams are just different streams of Consciousness data being focused on with slightly different (looser) rules set. The stream of Consciousness when awareness is here is also data, like that? If the time is right you cannot say the wrong thing, but if the time isn't right you cannot say the right thing. That applies to helping people get off drugs, but it seems useful here as well. :)
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

I think that MBT theory as Tom puts it holds that consciousness is one of the basic givens, simply postulated to be (All formal logical systems have basics ideas that are simply recognized to exist, "as given" and are inherently undefinable. Information is something that consciousness can experience, and it might be said to be 'data with structure'.

To get a good concrete sense of the term 'data with structure' means, think of the notes of a melody... each independent note is relatively meaningless by itself... it needs all the other notes and needs them in the right places in order for itself to have any meaning, all this perceived from the human perspective of course.

Hope that helps,

Montana

Lumpy,

Remember the basic description of a digital Consciousness System where we reside as Individuated Units of Consciousness. We exist as digital code and data that has consciousness and exists in the non physical reality which is the basis for everything. The bottom most turtle in the stack. This is where the basic 'given' that Montana refers to arises. Another way to refer to data is information. To say much more gets into considerable more complication such as interconnection over the RWW. The nature of Virtual Realities, etc.

Many people have probably accepted the idea of eventually there being conscious computers. Well, explain that they already exist and they are us. We are digital consciousnesses existing in a non physical reality that is basically consciousness. Ultimately there are no short descriptions that are going to be accessible to everyone. That's why Tom's books are over 800 pages total. Unless you already have a lot of the concepts in your mind, it takes a great deal of basic description to get there.

Ted