Kroeran, I aggree with what you say.

Altho i have gone to the liquare store more times than to listen to the Bible man, I got a good dose of it growing up. I read the bible completely when i was Young kid. Went to church all growing up, by brother went there at the time he and all the members were ass holes so i stoped going, Recently a girl on the street gave me a bible i read a huge chunck over again. My opion is somebody knows how to write epic ass book. "In the begining there was but a word.. and the word was God!"
May be the most epic book iv ever read. any ways.. Other day i
saw a SiGN in front of a church> IT read ... "Fearing GOD IS Courages"

Sure in the past when it started with just a few people, Probably very gunuine based on personal experinces and truth. Over time shure diluted to what it is today. That point on the topic in my opion this has little worth. "ya my dog continues to dig up your yard but when he was young he was a sweet puppy"
Im not saying if i saw Jesus i would throw a rock at him.

All religions are based on Many extermly important truths. All should be studyed and try to grow from. All Cults also need many important Truths.
Truths verify circle logic. The more powerfull and correct the truths are the more confining the Cult can become. Say a religous person experence OOBE in a million years you can not convince him it was not omen god. Say they forgive thier nabor, and a burden is lifted, Testiment to the power of god.
Even a new age cult. Understands EGo and how it controlls our choices, They understand MBT logic very very well. All they needed to get traped was.
A hooK: fear that allowing others to starv and sufer is evil
A sacrad assumption: Only changing the system/culture that instills the ego will the suffering stop.
The montain of truth they posses is used for/ rituals/rutting/coman sense logic/pryimiding/logical loops/progressivism.

With out the fear shure there is tons to learn from all realigions. EVen with the fear it seems Obvious to me. Sure theres tons room for people to grow in a religion. there can be a montain of truth a life time of truths ready to be learned in a religion. At some point when they will get to the sacrad assumption and be walled off from ever evolving further. Some people starting from where they are at need different range of choices to interact from. I don't codone blowing up religions. all tho i will mention the harm they can do to be fair.

I was Watching The ORiely Factor" and his argument was..
*whats wrong with people believing in religion, if a society didn't have retrobution they would do what ever they want w/ no consiquences.. Its nessasary for society.

If you are raising a group of kids, If you say don't be bad cuse freddy cougar will come eat you. Yes that will be usefull to making them behave, but when they are 25 and need to get a job and they wont leave their room cuse freddy cougar might get them thats very damaging.
Plus instead of using fear in first place why not be rational. If you buy kid a toy and he breaks it tell him, i wont buy you another toy for a month, instead of breaking out the freddy mask. If a person in society acts bad, remove them and put them in jail(time out) thats a rational way to limit the damage on C growth by Selfish entites.


I also think the people either choose the bootle or the bible is very wise:
To be fearless is to balance on a fine line. The tinyest bit of fear will tip toe you to one side progresssivly. over time every one is moving away fform a balanced posistion to one side of the polorizing fears. DEmocarat/Republican one tiny needs pulls you to one side and eventually will engulf you. Atheist/Religions ...Booz/Bible

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All Praise to Dez Bryant "Feed tha Beast"

When the angels and demons are no longer at war inside you, only peace is left. Balance is the key to living happily.

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"All the world's a Stage and all the men and women merely players, They have their exits and their entrances and ONE man in his time plays many parts, his acts beings Heaven ages"---Shakespeare

That is such a warped way of thinking Randy, the bible or the bottle. People who are not blinded by faith in that fiction that has created in them this belief that if they go with sanity and leaning on their own understanding they will suddenly become evil monsters. You probably cannot see this because you are one of the blind unfortunately and extremely so which requires my open minded skepticism to work overtime in considering you a TOEhead. It must be really hard from inside your Reality though, man.

So you think a person named Luke had some useful information? That's possible since even in the most fantastical fiction there lay some true elements. Especially when the work is required to be taken seriously and get lies installed into minds they have to put something people will see as true. Tricky old farts.
Love
Bette

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All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

Bette,

That option between the bottle and the bible isn't Randy's idea, he repeats someone else. And remember that he is talking about a rural minimal community. They typically do not have a wide range of activities or scope of intellectual range. There you pretty literally find yourself stuck with the church or with drinking or a combination. There is no lending library or book store. Everyone knows everyone else and their business, no secrets and less tolerance. There is no adolescent sexual experimentation not followed by a shotgun wedding. And half the farmers make 'shine'.

Ted

lol, ya thats where i live it is very true, altho they battle between the bibble and the bottle they tend to do both well. There is a documentary on netflix online about, the White family. its about a family living in a comunity just like this only more extreme than you could ever emagine. They have an insanly rough life if you got a coal mining job you hit jack pot; life of daily weed,snorting pills,liqure,dying,killing,havn babies, they have bible stuff every 2inchs in thier trailers, It ends w/ them all concluding they will burn in hell for thier sins.

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All Praise to Dez Bryant "Feed tha Beast"

That's too bad they had too many negatives going for them for the weed to have done its magic...

Ted and Randy you two are miming old stale BS. There are other options to behaviors of people anywhere you two are ignoring. The damage done from a false "authority" is what I am working to reduce from Reality for as many as want to be released from it not specifically religion by the way. Any authority is to be questioned and is being widely so that is the deal. The damage done by believing in false authority that makes one damn themselves. I cannot stand it. Authority, a false believe that it meant something, is how I have been harmed and so am motivated to help others falling for it. I have raised my children to have no false respect of "authority" to the point of me not being one to them but rather an equal to be questioned openly without fear and so have a LOT of other people so we should be seeing larger effects from this more every day, and we are.

Question ALL authority the older the authority the more questionable it is. What is the oldest false authority? That is where I am coming from all authority is false. permitted my ars...:)

Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

I DO like the way you said it, even though being new to the MBToe terminology. Anyone have any good OOBE's recently? Probably wrong thread...

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May our communications be complementary.

The core idea is that it is un-TOE to have thoughts dominated by our personal superiority to others, which is ego's trick to distract us from our own crap, our own crap being our primary mission

In certain environments, it is possible that the fire breathing preacher is the best AUM can manage, given what it has to work with, to move the simulation forward in that locale

It is likely that fear motivation is merely at the level of what Tom calls establishing a civil society, which however supports sufficient social order for something important to happen at the QoC level -disorder and challenge has diminishing returns beyond a certain point for evolving QoC

When FWAUs are ready, they move on from this, which is what my dad did

As far as bible reading, I would just keep rereading Luke until the personality starts to come through, although I have time for proverbs and ecclesiastes, and I have a huge problem with Paul, who I believe began the distortion of the Nazarene's teaching from wisdom and compassion toward believism, which is what FWAUs such as Bette rightly gag on.

Not trying to turn this into a bible study...just trying to help you integrate your background with MBTOE so that you can make peace with your past and surroundings and move on, moving on mainly being turning your judgement reflex upon your role in this drama in your town

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Does this PMR make my butt look big?

It appears that such an environment is as good as any other for reaching for better intent within the decision space provided, an organic inescapable process which transcends the veneer of religion, philosophy or the lack thereof

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Does this PMR make my butt look big?

I don't need to read some fiction so many times that I start believing it is true Randy.

It's not me that thinks I am superior and it is not me that is bound on being judgmental Randy but rather your Beliefs and possibly then you.
Love
Bette

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All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

For example, the suggestion to do good to those that curse you, is not a belief, but is rather a tactic

Jesus rarely drifted into belief and where he does I suspect it is believist revisionism

This is my summary of what is actually recorded off the top of my head

- concern yourself with your own failings rather than the failings of others
- the universe will forgive you according to the forgiveness you practice
- do good to those that harm you
- Directed belief can physically heal
- consider loans gifts
- do not let petty offenses undermine harmonious relations with others
- excessive and especially dishonest effort regarding money, specifically unemployed/unconsumed wealth, is a waste of a life and damaging to your eternal soul, this is love of money
- things are slightly less egregious as a focus, however, for some, excessive possessions can be a distraction from happiness, which lies in human relations
- beware of how ego corrupts religious life and practice and the priesthood
- beware of creating a religious veneer rather than good intent
- beware of food snobbery...rather restrain our hurtful words
- prayer is a private thing, not a public display

About to run out of power....will pause

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Does this PMR make my butt look big?

If Jesus were here today he'd be the biggest rock star ever known.

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"All the world's a Stage and all the men and women merely players, They have their exits and their entrances and ONE man in his time plays many parts, his acts beings Heaven ages"---Shakespeare

This PMR is a kindergarten. We all do our best, but changes come from within, not from outside. I can imaging, that an aggressive approach in promoting my MBT belief doesn't do any good, and finally could place MBT next to the existing religions.

I believe, that this is a right time for MBT, and this is why Tom has it published and made available to anyone on Google. The last thing we want to happen is to make it a new MBT religion. This is a very fine borderline between where we are right now, and moving to a new religion. This is my real concern with MBT today, and not how fast and how many people will learn about it in my lifetime.

I think the best support for MBT is to underline its similarities with Bible and teachings of mystics. As far, as I can see, MBT's main thought is a death is not the end of you, and you are more, than your physical body. After you die is going to be no punishment for your 'sins', but you will be given more chances to improve yourself. Consciousness (god) is your source and beginning, and Love is your destination. Your intent is what and who you are. If you hate your enemy, your intent is not taking you toward Love. With all my limited knowledge of Bible, and my personal awareness of MBT, finally I am able to see more similarities between two of them. Our previous experience with religion is based on fear, and rejection of similarities is our fear. Acceptance is a first step to understanding, and to Love.

Lena

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'Real knowledge is to know the extent of ones ignorance.' Confucius.

There are other teachers who, even before the manifestation of the Christ spirit, also taught same basic spiritual rules. I think they were trying to show the way out of the trap this universe has become. And I think turning the other cheek is a hallmark of the progress a being has made in no longer having an automatic vengeance response, which is endemic on this planet, even in the best, most elite of us. I will know my own progress by the degree to which I exercise other choices than revenge compulsions that follow a perceived hurt.

Your grasp of what a being who understands the games he played that got him into his current condition is relatively lofty, and demonstrative of native ethics and compassion. The less mind matter the less there is to mind about :-)

The "bewares" and "Nevers" that our teachers give us are good for our daily meditation in addition to our clearing practices -- whatever Timebreaks the "thens" from the "now" or other "thens" and thus frees us from Paul's lament, "Why do I do the things I hate?", and no longer have to literally flail our bodies with jagged whips.

BTW, does TWC have any subjective knowledge of true 5th dimensional beings? My current understanding is that they are beings who can still move freely in and out of universes, having not forgotten how to play at the top of the game vector. If so, these are beings I wish to rsonate with. I have a friend who appeared to contact such a being, but she was not the questioner that I am, and I am probably not purified enough to resonate that finely. Perhaps this is for another thread....

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May our communications be complementary.

Well said, and upon reflection caused by what you wrote, the problem I have experienced with religions and cults and sects, even the teachings I now practice, the problem is that the actual doingnesses that one must personally practice become de-emphasized and even lost over time. Does anyone know what actual practices Buddha gave to his dedicated students who did great things, or to Christ's disciples who did as great or greater things than him yet are not even written about today?

Thank god for the internet and the good fortune I have to have found a teacher returned from the dead (and now gone again, hopefully never to have to return), so to speak, with the practices still pronounced and prominent next to the necessary simple teachings and theories to back them up. Not yet corrupted and dismissed by councils and emperors. Even among my small band of associates there is too much discussion (I am guilty too) unbalanced with just doing the work, so heavy is the addiction to the sensualities associated with bodies, embodiment, and even before bodies. For example, in last nights rather expansive session I gave myself, I realized that an ancient, almost pre-time obsession for creating "nice surprises" via the sensual psychedelics of twisting spirals (e.g., our fractal system as a means of getting sensation). I realized how buried my head was, like a cat with his head trapped in a paper bag. I am glad I was able to see what I was still doing, and thus able to pull out of that compulsion a bit.

If someone would like to help me put what I am saying into the MBT template, I would love the assistance, thank you.

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May our communications be complementary.