I know Tom has discussed the contemplation of a beginning and how that contemplation is usually conditioned by our PMR rule set and cultural constraints. Recently I wondered why the Akashic Records wouldn't contain information that revealed the beginning or at least revealed the first conscious activity after the beginning. Has Tom addressed this question?

Ben,

What you are asking is not clear. Beginning of what?

Ted

Ted,

I'm referring to the beginning of conscious experience/thought. Shouldn't the database that contains all conscious experience contain the first thought, the first 1 or 0 (in digital terminology), the first variation other than nothingness. I know the "chronological first tick" probably would not explain where consciousness came from, but it may shed light on the original manifestations and intuitions of consciousness.

I also understand the term "chronological" may not have the same meaning in NPMR, but because the Akashic Records/database can be analyzed chronologically, that is the terminology I've chosen to use.

Ben,

I would say from your comments, the conceptions that you have, that you would possibly answer your own questions if you were to look at the full model Tom created where written up on the Wiki. http://wiki.my-big-toe.com/index.php/Th ... _Link_Page I wrote this up after extensive writing and discussion with Tom. Tom has made no changes nor suggested any changes and it matches Tom's original books with the addition of mathematical references and some additional concepts from so called, pure mathematics, included more explicitly than Tom originally wrote it up. The description of the 'boot strapping' process to conscious does have some more discussion than Tom originally included although ultimately, there is a leap, the bootstrapping, that cannot be fully described and probably can never be described until possibly if we can create consciousness within a PMR built computer and observe the process completely. We simply do not have access to those 'early times' within AUM.

As some kind of explanation of what I just said and how things worked out over time, it makes me think of discussions with a Zen master as described in some of the old records of early Zen historical times. I would spend time over some period and think I had thought of something new. I would explain it to Tom. He would then proceed to show me a reference in his books that covered what I 'added' to his description. So while I did add to his description in terms of making it shorter, all in one place instead of distributed through his books, and more explicit in the sense that some things are spelled out more clearly, it is Tom's model and he has so far chosen to not change anything. It is also without all of Tom's discursive writing for beginners. I would say that it is no more difficult to understand. It does have some precursors in term of ideas, thus Tom's discursions to explain things, that you must have in your experience to fully understand it but it is easier in the sense that there are references to mathematics concepts and an actual published academic paper that will give you an outline of these concepts if they are not already in your mental arsenal. It is not a perfect 'Wiki style' write up at present but that will come with time.

Try reading through it and seeing if the answers are there and then coming back with your questions. For the moment you seem to be thinking in terms of the beginnings of PMR. Yes, those records are there within the data bases that Tom describes. But other things seem to indicate that you mean the very beginning of consciousness for AUM. The model contains the best information that we have for that but we have only indications. What you are referring to as the Akashic records and Tom refers to as the actualized data base did not exist at that time. Yes, there is in Tom's model a description of reality that should imply that those vast stretches of time are still recorded in the LCS structure as a Cellular Automaton based record of the process as it developed. It is not available to us however as IUOCs. If and when you more fully understand the model, you will see why this is so. Simply put, what you call the Akashic records came much later when AUM became AUM as the many NPMRs and later PMRs were created. The arising of Consciousness came much earlier in the development sequence.

Ted

What i think Ben is bringing up is in fact AUM`s deepest instinct to wonder about where it came from. Passed on to us by or connection with it, i will not confuse things here with my speculation, read what Ted has pointed out. And then maybe go to the topic in play now What Is Consciousness?, or just continue here. MBT does in fact cause this type of expansion, and openness to wonder what is outside of this system, that MBT describes. As of now all that is, is, in my opinion assumptions and speculation. Who knows!. Sabby

Fred,

If you also were to take my advice above, you could perhaps also understand why we, and no one that we can imagine, can tell you what lies outside of AUM. The thing is that what Tom says is the origin of things and I agree with is a non physical Void that has been the same thing that everyone who has reached the point of saying is the origin of everything. The rest of it also matches up with what others have said. So you have this consistency, this fit, no matter who looks and what their 'beliefs' might happen to be. Who am I talking about as they? The Buddha for one. Ancient Indian metaphysicians for one. Mystics of all ages and persuasions for one. What common elements? The ones that I keep mentioning. The Void, the Void as quickened and starting to function as a Cellular Automaton, where the reality cells and the random data in them start to interact. This is less commonly encountered but is still described as activated or quickened. The Reality Wide Web as Indra's Net.

These things are the underlying basis for what Tom describes. In this view, this model, there is simply no basis for another such reality as AUM has developed into to be out there as something that could be communicated with. That of course does not mean that there cannot be more. One can speculate as Tom facetiously stated it in there being a whole herd of AUMosauruses out there. But there is no indication this exists. If this did exist, then why would AUM have developed inwardly with the creation of all of the NPMRs and PMRs for all of us IUOCs to function within and for us to be conscious? It would have been much simpler to focus outwardly on this presumed potential society of equals than to do all of this inward focusing and development.

So to go outward is speculation of something which we see no way to have any contact with. If there were contact, it would not be at our level. Speculate on pie in the sky bye and bye, if you wish. Speculate on whatever you wish. Just don't confuse people by implying that if you don't speculate, you know nothing. Tom has speculated in a facetious way. Nothing wrong with speculating. I would personally speculate that a good basis for speculating would be to first understand what Tom has described as a starting point. At least that is consistent, logical and specifically consistent with what so many other teachers have said, albeit with different and more limited metaphors than those of science and mathematics.

I would also speculate that open ended speculation is not a good basis for figuring things out and creating a better version or vision of reality. That way lies never having a starting point and actually creating something which can then be evaluated based upon what it produces, what it develops, what it can be used for. You can never do this because you are endlessly speculating so there is no foundation to build upon. Tom's work passes this evaluation test pretty well. Endless speculation never gets this far.

Ted

The answer to your first question why did AUM create VR, is because it was a natural thing for it to do, this is how it grows evolves. The same as we create simulations here, as to better organize ourselves with a trainer. Very true, to speculate as to what is outside of AUM, or created AUM, if anything, really only gets us to our limits of what we can know. With that said i still prefer to live that question, if for no other reason it helps me function better in this system we are apart of. And also it gives me personally a better understanding of MBT. - I think the same as you do about Toms model giving us a clear understanding as to the nature of reality. the beings you describe no doubt experienced the LCS, but simply did not have the tools as Tom does to explain in such of a logical clear way. His ground breaking scientific theory is a great reference tool to start with, as to continue our journey in to the fundamental reality. Remember we never really know where the data is coming from, perhaps some may be coming from outside of AUM. Sabby