So where does Happiness, Pleasure, Joy, and Ecstasy fit in all this?
Do we drop them by the wayside?
Do we experience them in a new and different way?
Do we finally outgrow them, because they are only artifacts of our PMR?

_________________
Who said it would be easy? If it was easy, somebody else would have been given the assignment.

I think Joy is our default. All those things are good, what changes is what "makes" one feel these emotions, in my opinion.
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

rchamberlin,

Why do you think that those emotions are inherent and limited to PMR? What would make this so? The sources might be different, but I don't see that there is anything special about PMR that makes them limited to this VR only. They are not dependent upon physicality that I can see.

Ted

According to Tom's Big TOE (as I understand it), it is all about evolution and decreasing entropy. That decrease in entropy equates to an increase in love capacity (to give, receive, express, and be love). With that in mind, "Happiness, Pleasure, Joy, and Ecstasy" would seem to fit into this process. I suppose it depends on how one defines these specif sensations and emotions, but a growth toward love would seem to include and perhaps augment these things.

I know that happiness, pleasure, joy, and ecstasy are things that I have experienced in relation to love and my own evolution.

Great question, and welcome to the forum.

_________________
-"You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you might find... you get what you need"

Ted,
My post contained all questions. Nowhere did I state that "I think..."

Actually, from my personal experience, Joy, Happiness, and Pleasure are no longer experienced in the inner and higher
locals. It more approaches Ecstasy! Joy, Happiness, and Pleasure are very poor almost colorless descriptive terms
for what NPMR has to offer. Even Ecstasy is a pale term to describe my experience.

I only ask, because I couldn't find any references in particular to those four charged words in Tom's My Big TOE.
Between the lines I wanted to know if there was any room for them in THE BIG TOE, or was my experience bogus.

To restate my questions in a nutshell - What do you experience or expect to experience beyond PMR?

_________________
Who said it would be easy? If it was easy, somebody else would have been given the assignment.

I agree RC, NPMR can be ecstasy and beyond. Tom doesn't go much into that part of it. Maybe he doesn't want to spoil the movie or persuade the experience.If some people harbor fear then it could be quite scary.But it is heightened.

_________________
Shut up and meditate

Rob,

To post those questions in that manner and where posted implies the expectation of an answer based upon the manner in which they were stated. Why are you posting in the Beginner's forum with the implications that entails if you have extensive experience in NPMR and are not expecting a limited and forthright answer but rather an answer between the lines based upon guessing your intent? Put a penny in the gumball machine and expect a piece of gum. This forum is intended to entice the hesitating lurkers to dip a toe in the water and not expect to be overwhelmed with the results and it is so stated in the notice at the beginning. The way that purpose is ignored, from both directions, we should probably consider the experiment as failed and discontinue it.

"What do you experience or expect to experience beyond PMR?"

Anything and everything, from a visit to purgatory, if that is your expectation, to 72 virgin houris ready to take you briefly to paradise!

Ted

Ted,
I do not have extensive experience in NPMR.
I am attempting to construct my own TOE, and to do so, I am seeking some answers to questions which I have which will, I hope cover areas of which I am ignorant.
If showing a small part of that ignorance in an inappropriate manner causes problems, then I apologize.
I have huge gaps in understanding and experience, and I expect that due to my ineptitude, that will become apparent.
And yes, I have been on this pathway for over 40 years, and still know almost nothing. But, what little I do know, is that Tom
is not a nutcase, he knows whereof he speaks and writes.
I do plan on watching his London lecture as soon as possible.

In the meantime, pardon me if I don't yet fit in the mold of a beginner. I am a beginner of The Big TOE and until I integrate it with
My own TOE, I will continue to ask beginner questions, but will expect a Master's answers.

Namaste

rob

_________________
Who said it would be easy? If it was easy, somebody else would have been given the assignment.

I think I said "I think", and we are all beginners. :) hmm, "smilies are off" (look to your right when composing), I think we have smilies here guys!
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.