Andre you are talking about this with the doctor you have seen for the depression? Did you make your appointment, did you go to it?
Love
Bette

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All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

Thank you for your concern. The doctor gave me some pills and asked for some tests. I should be checking back with him once the tests are done. Talking about what exactly?

I see, anything intellectual will not make you reconsider then. But in last hope; The illusion of love is easily mistaken for love (love: what is about the other, unconditional and universal).

I hope that you will overcome your depression. "The darkest hour is just before the dawn" - have hope!

Andre,

I would prefer you to answer the questions asked as to your intent in these recent posts. Not to divert attention from the fact that you have not answered by asking further questions. One cannot interact in PMR without violating the will of others. But there are violations and then there are violations. Abraham Lincoln told the story of walking with his two sons who were crying. When a friend asked him what was the problem with his two sons, Lincoln is said to have replied, "The same thing that is wrong with all the world. I have three walnuts in my pocket and each wants two."

It is not acceptable to say in the face of oppression, well that's free will. Those who can in any way counter oppression at the cost of the free will of the oppressor should do so. If some have manipulated society to their advantage to the point that they have ownership of a very high percentage of the goods produced by society, especially to the point that many have nothing or nearly so, those with nearly everything must simply either be willing or be made by society to contribute to the welfare of others, free will or not. Particularly considering that the goods and services produced by society are being produced by the efforts of those who have little.

If you are taking the path of control as your ideal as Tom Campbell has described it, then you will not find a comfortable home here. Now as previously asked, what is your intent here? Control versus freedom. Nazis sympathizer or simply explaining their delusional thinking? Yes, you are correct in that the German people as a people were not responsible for all that was done by the Nazis and many resisted and many died for that resistance. I am not certain whether part of my ancestry came from Germany or from Britain by way of Germanic origins. Either way, I do not blame 'the Germans' but rather the Nazis. Others can no doubt make that distinction as well. The present problem is that you are being ambiguous in your postings and clarification of your intent would be appreciated.

Ted

Thank you.

I suggest you study the economic theory of liberal, laissez-faire capitalism and how it resolves the issue of desires versus rights. You are mistaken if you believe goods are produced by society. They are produced IN society. There is a huge difference. The industrialist is not exploiting society. There ARE exploiters in society, but merely having wealth does not mean you have exploited anyone, nor does not having wealth mean someone took anything from you. The wealthy are, in many cases, simply the most productive people in a society, and the poor the least productive.




What is taxation if not control?




Freedom. I'm absolutely NOT a nazi sympathizer.




It would help me to understand where the ambiguity lies. If it seems that I'm defending the nazis, it's probably because there is a flaw in your thinking process that perceives their way of thinking (altruistic collectivism) as good. That's not my fault. I'm not going to pretend the nazis were some sort of greedy selfish monsters just because that is the only kind of evil you people can recognize.

Andre,

Why is it that some people cannot answer simple questions but must write long and elaborate deviations from and justifications for not making simple answers? Your last paragraph is badly written and is contradictory.The highlighting with color is mine. I most certainly do not think and have in no way stated that their 'altruistic collectivism' as you call it is good. Rather the opposite if it is usable to justify killing people for the good of the state.

Are we then to take it that you are on the side of control versus freedom and that you are effectively agreeing with the Nazis approach to the proper way to improve society? Remove 'defectives' and 'garbage people' or whatever the terminology was?

Your last statements were almost definitive but not quite perfectly clear yet. Please try again.

Ted

Most people dont know that the Fuehrer was a terrific dancer , lol

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LOVE is the answer

peace
patrick

I think this is actually turning out to be a really good thread. Thank you andre for the stimulating discussion so far, you have been a catalyst. Please keep interacting to the best of your ability, I wish you the best.

I have my own troubles with understanding love so I'm going to attempt to weave myself into some of the discussion.



SS,

My interpretation of Andre's paragraph above is that the word love is being confused by the word belief. The way the Nazis gave the Germans a way to escape their fears was by offering a belief system. A cultural belief system that the way of the Reich was the best solution for the Germans.

Belief systems create illusions, and are illusions themselves. Is this what you mean by "The illusion of love is easily mistaken for love"?

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Mike

No.

Thank you.




Yes and no. What they offered was primarily a way for the germans to transcend their existential angst by loving something greater than their own individual selves, namely, the Reich, meaning the "nation", or "society". The belief system as such (things like, "marrying jews is bad", "having aryan children is good") is secondary.




Have you read 1984? You don't even need to read it, just watch the movies.

By LOVING the reich??
sorry but this is being perceived by me as nonsense.
Patriotism is not love. patriotism and flag waving is based on ego, separatism, and ultimately it is fear in disguise. This patriotic "love of country" line is used all the time as an excuse for war. sounds like the same old rhetoric. Just an excuse to manipulate the fearful into anger, hate, war and death

_________________
LOVE is the answer

peace
patrick

Not so much nonsense, Patrick. More a matter of deliberate obfuscation. Trying to create the illusion of depth by way of confusion. The implication of deep meaning by purposeful obscurity. Deliberate non cooperation with any attempt at obtaining clarity. Techniques used before here.

Ted

Thank you for making clear to me what happens when you purposefully blank out your mind. I will no longer post here. I'll find another way to heal from depression. I should have known.

Sorry Andre if the shoe fit. No doubt I am wrong and you have been the height of clarity. There is no place that you can post that will cure your depression. Especially if you go in for existential angst. Things just don't work that way. The doctor is the place for you to go for your depression.

Ted