OK, I'm wondering what the future is for the whole thing?

I mean, if we accept the idea that lowering entropy of the entire system is the goal, and that the choice is evolve and grow, or deevolve and eventually die, and finally that infinity doesn't exist, then the question arises about just how far we can evolve, and both AS individual FWAUs as well as the system as a whole. Does there come a point where we ALL have achieved "perfection" (even if it takes trillions of trillions of years), and if so, then what?

It'll be like a permanent, never ending vacation in Hawaii with nothing but other fully enlightened beings?

DF,

The primary origin of entropy among IUOCs is that new ones are being created all the time. The system is understood to be open ended until proven otherwise. Entropy is not something that goes to zero either but rather asymptotically approaches a minimum. There is expected to be no pie in the sky bye and bye. Just growing diversity and open ended potential. We are all in it for the long haul. No, you won't be graduating this term either.

Ted

I may not graduate this term, but if I understand correctly, eventually I will. It may take 1,000 lifetimes, and it may take 10,000 (and I may have already had 10,000) but eventually, I'll get it right. I'd like to think I'm on the right path, but perhaps that's ego talking.

I suppose I can accept the idea that there is, and will forever be (at least insofar as we can grasp "real" time), new and fresh FWAUs, but my question is still pertinent. A few billion years from now, when most existing FWAUs have achieved full enlightenment, what's next for us?

Partying like rock stars for all of eternity, with nothing but pleasure and absolutely no worries of any kind? Sounds like a good deal to me!

I did not mean negativity regarding you in what I said. It is just that no one ever really graduates. The situation is basically as I said and the creation of new IUOCs is sufficient to keep things always at a low level as they are accepted and started into the system. Tom has explained before that this is the reason that things stay at a kindergarten level here as the result of so many newcomers. While some may graduate in the sense of doing something else than coming back here, the usual is to start to serve the needs of the system by continuing to reincarnate as needed as a 'training agent' in place or in whatever way is required. When you get there, you will feel more of the need for serving the system instead of 'partying'.

Ted

DentalFloss,

Like Ted said, I suspect that one of the later steps we take while "graduating" is to help the newer IUOC's evolve. Part of the admin team, I guess.

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Mike

...And then one might find that that admin team is yet another stage/play for direct experience. So after countless experiences there, then one may join the admin team that helps the admin team. And then later the admin team that helps the admin team help the admin team. And of course this space/time PMR is not the end all of available realities or experiences.

Also consider the idea that we are all one. If all of us are currently here in this PMR and attempting to pull ourselves up by the bootstraps... then AUM is also changing and growing as we do (each effects the whole). In this way, any such end point is constantly in a state of flux. Perhaps like running in a race where the finish line never stays in one place long enough for anybody to cross it.

We are a spec in the universe, and that universe is virtual! And there are countless other virtual learning labs. It is not really conceivable to fully comprehend the expanse of such a system. What is beyond AUM? perhaps another "admin". Imagine if AUM is one of countless consciousness blobs that makes up AUM's AUM. Anyway, the point is that we really just have so say "who knows for sure". This is why it becomes important to live gracefully with uncertainty and to remain open-minded and skeptical. One thing we can say though is that working toward being more loving and letting go of fear and ego leads to long term positive results; while being selfish and full of fear and ego leads to long term negative results. That is something that can be experienced and learned to a fairly high degree of certainty right here in a single PMR lifetime. A quick look at say Ghandi vs. a gang member in prison sheds some light on that fact... and of course our own experiences do the most for us.

The secret to uncovering life's big questions really has little to do with the intellect, but everything to do with growth. The more we grow the more we know... by default. Experience is the key to understanding. I am of course not saying that we should avoid thinking about such things, but that we should not expect any solid answers that way. Ego, fear, and beliefs are willing to provide answers through the intellect... but we know where that leads; in circles).

Just some thoughts.

_________________
-"You can't always get what you want, but if you try sometimes, you might find... you get what you need"

I did not infer any, though I was under the (misguided?) impression that graduation was not only possible, it was inevitable.



That does make sense to a degree, though I think as a species we are improving, even if it's exceedingly slowly. While there are exceptions, much of humanity now lives in circumstances that they are no longer in danger of being burned at a stake for believing the wrong things about spirituality. Our science may very well be on the verge of proving ideas, like Tom's MBT, that may result in a paradigm shift.

But, the idea that once a IUOC reaches a certain amount of experience they move on to a different PMR makes sense, especially in light of the fact that one day, many trillions of years from now, this PMR will be uninhabitable.



Perhaps it's just a sign of my relative high entropy consciousness, but service for all of eternity sounds like a lot of hard work, with very little reward. It's almost analogous to me of the idea of spending all of eternity worshiping.

But don't you see, you serve yourself. You are an integral part of AUM.

Ted

I get that. At least I think I do, ironically that concept, at least in part, is what led to my original question. The idea of spending all of eternity experiencing nothing but oneness seems eternally boring!

Some of my favorite times are those shared with our circle of friends. Whether we're sharing a meal, sitting around shooting the shit and laughing with (and at) each other, lounging in the pool, or having an orgy, being around those folks brings me great joy and happiness. There have been many times that it seemed to transcend the physical and become almost a spiritual experience, including seemingly stupid stuff like simply bouncing a beach ball around a circle.

The idea of literally merging with them has some appeal, because at times I can literally FEEL the oneness, but on the other hand, bouncing a beachball around as a single, lonely being doesn't appeal to me nearly as much. In fact, at the risk of being repetitive, it sounds downright boring.

You simply have not gotten the 'big picture' as yet. You as your 'real' self are not ever going to be alone as you can be in communication with others continuously. You are not however ever going to be able to participate in an orgy in your continuous existence in NPMR. It is just conceivable that your 'circle of friends' might in fact be a 'circle of friends' there and participate in the NPMR version of the closeness of sex. A good target for you to meditate about. Do I know 'them' elsewhere?

Ted

Good suggestion, though I've never tried meditating with a "target", would appreciate whatever advice you (or anyone else) may have on how to do so.

As to whether or not we can have an orgy in NPMR, it matters not. The sexual adventures we share are awesome, and I love every minute of it, but it's the human (or dare I say, spiritual) connection that we share that I really care about. To me, the sexual aspect is merely a symptom of our shared connection, and that connection is what's really important.

At the risk of being cliche, the sex is merely the icing on the cake.

I am absolutely convinced that at least a subset of them are a "circle of friends" outside PMR. That we've known each other across the span of many lifetimes. One person in particular that I share an incredible bond with, and I was so worried about her with last weekends hurricane that somehow I remote viewed her, and observed a conversation that actually happened that could not possibly have been a coincidence. Something I've never done before, at least as far as I know.

I'm not as close with her as with my wife, but it is close.

In Monroes book Far Journeys he quotes someone as saying "if there had been two obstacles as difficult as sex, I might never have reached enlightenment" I see it as a challenge to get through, a residual of physical manifestation.Letting go of physical desires wants and needs. It is a lot of fun no doubt but perhaps not why we are there?

It is very difficult to not respond to so much freedom in NPMR and as a being primarily in PMR I feel let loose in the candy store.

It seems to be expected somehow.........in NPMR........just something else to figure out.

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Shut up and meditate

I think I posted some of this elsewhere, but this is from a private correspondence between Tom and myself. He kind of alludes to this point of "graduating" or assisting PMR residents from NPMR without incarnating. He seems to imply in the below statement that more highly advanced entities are in fact opting out of incarnation for the most part or seem to have evolved to a point where a PMR incarnation is not necessary. And the 'well developed souls' that DO incarnate, seem to do so mainly to be a good influence or nudge for others...



Regardless of interpretation- it was an interesting statement from Tom, no matter how you slice it :)...

-Cole

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Never live so certainly as to confuse your own convictions with what is true.

Cole,

From your quotation above:Do you recognize Tom here?

Ted

That was absolutely the thought in my head too, Ted, and of other readers also, I'm sure.

Also note the certainty with which Tom states the situation regarding the "Speakers". Intriguing. Thanks for posting the exchange Cole.

Arthur

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"Life is what happens to you while you're busy making other plans."