bobolink,

WE are IUOCs which are digital minds which reside within Consciousness Space, interconnected to each other and to The Big Computer by the Reality Wide Web. Over the RWW we receive our TBC generated digital data stream that represents all of our experience of PMR as a Virtual Reality. We as our IUOCs are the choice makers. We do this as a Free Will Awaremess Unit as it has been called that is a subset of our IUOC made especially to be subject to the PMR rule set. That is the real you that makes all the decisions and does all the thinking. That is the you that has the free will which is a necessity to your having consciousness. You as your body and your brain as is thought of as the source of your mind is just part of the digital data stream defining PMR experience, part of the VR simulation. Your brain does not even get rendered until something like a blunt instrument to the skull or a surgeons tools or a MRI shows it to exist.

This is all there in My Big TOE. If you need further discussion that you cannot find here on the board, as I have posted much as has Tom on this subject, please let me know.

Ted

Hi Ted,

Thanks for your reply. Yes I have read the book and had a look around this site and this is still confusing to me. I see free will as being a function of the VR rather than consciousness - can't consciousness i.e awareness, exist without making choices? Isn't this akin to what is called 'being level' in MBT?
Anyway, Your post has clarified for me that there is a dualism between mind and 'body' in MBT. Except that body - including the physical brain is described as being virtual.

Whether it's virtual or physical doesn't make any difference to my question as far as I can see. What's bothering me is where that virtual body/brain ends and the IOUC begins. How much of what I believe to be conscious decision making is actually a result of my IOUC doing the thinking, and how much is coming from the VR side i.e. survival as an (virtual) animal, unconscious desires being rationalised as they surface into my conscious mind.

Also
This seems incomplete. Lets say TBC doesn't render the visual appearance of the brain until someone cuts open your head and has a look - I can understand that. But I have been experiencing things specific to the VR body and brain- animal instincts to survive and procreate. Don't these in some way 'render' my body and brain on some level? Not visually, but to my experiencing self - my consciousness?

Anyway as you say I will probably find discussions in the forum already dealing with these issues as I can't be the only person to have been confused by this. And I will, one day make time to re-read the book!

Thanks for your time.

Bobolink,

Read this thread and see if it clarifies things, viewtopic.php?f=9&t=473

And if you want to read more on the brain how and it relates, search for "brain" as "twcjr" as the author. There are several posts which are useful.
search.php?keywords=brain&terms=all&author=twcjr&sc=1&sf=all&sk=t&sd=d&sr=posts&st=0&ch=300&t=0&submit=Search

bobolink,

This is where the VR rule set comes in. When you experience the VR, everything related to the VR comes to you via your data stream from TBC. That includes the 'feeling' of instinctual action. That includes even the thoughts that pass through your own experience of your mind. Unbelievable? Think about the relative speeds of the two VRs and of the base consciousness space that Tom describes. I will have to find the reference within MBT and make note of it on the board someday as I cannot find it right now. But remember that the delta t rate of our PMR VR is so fantastically small that it cannot be measured by PMR science. However our perceptions and thought rate here in the PMR VR is on the order of 0.001 seconds or even 0.01 seconds. Also remember that our IUOC is participating in NPMR and that has a delta t rate that is the same number of orders of magnitude faster than PMR as PMR is fast. Then our IUOC as its native rate as it participates as part of AUM is again at a delta t rate that is the same number of orders of magnitude faster than NPMR as NPMR is faster than PMR. The rate at which our digital IUOC runs through data and makes decisions, i.e. thinks, is so much fantastically faster than our perceived rate of thinking as limited by the PMR VR rule set that this must be so. So while our IUOC is the source of our thoughts, something, either as a function of our IUOC under the rule set of the VR or TBC must decide what is going to be delivered to our consciousness as part of our VR experience. We have no way to directly determine where that origin is. Since our IUOC processes at such a fantastically high native rate, I suspect that it comes from the Big Computer in the data stream.

I hope that this helps rather than just make things more confusing.

Ted

This is tricky territory. The words and symbols we use to describe our experience are usually inadequate to the task (here in this PMR)

Consciousness can be experienced from a variety of "STATES", and there are many ways that we can introduce "physical" changes to the body (and brain) that can trigger "ALTERED STATES" of consciousness. Chemicals are one way (but not advised) that we can alter our "state" of consciousness by introducing "physical" changes. Meditation, Binaural Beats, and "sleep" or the "dream state" are some other ways that we can alter our experience and awareness of consciousness.

If you consider Waking cinsciousness while dreaming and you consider dreaming consciousness while waking, you have already expanded your consciousness and awareness times 2. If you add Meditation, and "out of body" experiences to the equation consciousness understanding, knowledge, and awareness can be expanded and increased exponentially, the more you learn, the more you CAN learn. The more aware you become, the more awareness can be achieved.



Consciousness, by the definition , includes free will, without freewill you would be something other than conscious. Possibly a program, or an automaton, but consciousness evolution would not take place. The PMR is part of the "ruleset" and limitations imposed on your "subset" of consciousness. Some of the rules can be bent and others can be broken as part of the PUP (psi uncertainty principle) but the measure of our decision space is (at least partially) determined by the quality of our choices and interactions with our environment. But remember, NOT making a choice is STILL a choice. There are NO neutral parties in the game of Consciousness evolution.



As I see it this "boundary" between the smaller "subset" of consciousness (FWAU), and the larger "subset" of consciousness (IUOC) as well as The larger reality (NPMR) or the even larger consciousness system (LCS) depends upon YOU, your levels of awareness, knowledge, EGO and FEAR, as well as the quality of your interactions with your environment. There is an underlying UNITY of ALL THINGS, but the ILLUSION of SEPARATENESS IS reinforced by EGO and FEAR. You must first understand the relationship between LOVE and FEAR, and the science of entropy reduction (as it relates to consciousness evolution)



Scientists have cut open many skulls and disected many brains, and while we can be REASONABLY CERTAIN that you DO have one (lol, sorry) what they find is that each one is unique. As Tom has discussed in one of his group discussions (related to the brain structure of sheep, where they have found changes in the developement of the brains of certain animals that have formed the behavior of adopting orphaned lambs), our behavior, thoughts, and actions CAN and do render actual changes to the physical brain.

But it is the Physical that evolved, and continues to evolve, out of consciousness. Consciousness did not, and does not evolve out of the physical.

Much of our thoughts are influenced by EGO and separateness, and how much we identify with our EGO, or influenced by FEAR. This could mean that, while you have a need for food (for example), how do you acquire the food you need? Do you TAKE someone elses food or do you find your own, and what lengths are you willing to go for the need to satisfy SELF at the expense of others?


In MY mind there is only ONE consciousness, and ALL the information from the entire LCS is (or can be) accessed and received by ALL. The illusion of separateness is reinforced by our levels of EGO and FEAR. The more we are able to reduce our entropy, overcome EGO and FEAR, and become LOVE, The more access we have to the larger system. The less entropy, the increased decision space, increased LOVE, compassion, happiness and power.

_________________
LOVE is the answer

peace
patrick

Thanks to all three of you for your answers, there is so much info there it will take me a while to digest and understand it properly, but it definitely looks like that's the information I was looking for. And I think I do have a brain pgtrue because it is now hurting! ; 0

Tom briefly touches on first order, second order, and third order functioning of the FWAU

First is biologically driven, second is mentally driven, and third is higher ruleset driven, to over simplify

Biological sensor platforms have their own non sentient ruleset that they are moving through, that does not have free will, for example, sex leading to a new sensor platform birth

When a sensor platform is likely, a UIOC begins to transfer it's attention and absorption to it, with this process normally fully completing in childhood, if I recall Toms words on this correctly

What you then have is a bifurcate entity, a sensor platform with biological imperatives being piloted by a free will awareness unit, one hopefully with an appetite for the higher ruleset, and that is part of the creative tension of life

Throw a linear thinking left hemisphere into the mix making commentary, with an impulse to power and retirement planning, and this leads to three separate forces upon decision making

people tend to be dominated by one the three forces

_________________
Does this PMR make my butt look big?

Oh Randy really. Anti-choice?
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

Has anyone mentioned this yet? "Who and what has consciousness" is the wrong question.
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

Yes, I think you did mention it once before.

It's not really the wrong question. You might be referring to the technical definitions; Like if we are consciousness and have a body, or if we are a body and have consciousness. This is in the theories of this TOE.

But my question was more aimed at if trees and plants have consciousness, as is stated here that they don't, but Tom and others are suggesting they might.

My feeling on this is that plants are very well off on their own, without any animals or humans, and they have lived for millions of years like that, being aware and growing according to their own desires. Being aware is being conscious. Plants might in fact be very much more aware and conscious than humans, but they might be using their consciousness in a wiser way. To use ones consciousness would mean to exist. Plants are living closer to Nature, the higher consciousness.

The reason for that some might think plants don't have any consciousness might be that they are confusing plants decision space with their own decision space; Man is the worlds measure.

Actually I don't think that Tom has suggested that trees or plants are conscious or might be conscious. I think that if you look at all he has to say he is more acceding to strong beliefs on the part of some that they must have some slight degree of awareness as being alive, they do respond to their environment. Tom tries to meet people half way if possible. Remember in the discussions on the board in the past when Tom was talking about someone, the first conscious being of human level, observing X number of trees and someone later coming back after X is dead and possibly seeing Y number of trees. Conscious entities do not appear and disappear in this manner. TBC knows you are there and keeps you there in the 'scene'. You keep your link as an IUOC to the being that you are represented as in the VR until you die. That IUOC is the real you as your mind, making your decisions and experiencing your experiences.

I look at their response as purely physiological responses. Plants exhibit tropisms. From the Merriam-Webster dictionary:I mentioned other tropisms already besides turning toward light. This is not the same as a decision made by a conscious entity. Would you say that a rock sitting in the sunlight and growing warm from absorbed energy is doing this because it is conscious? It does not make a decision to absorb the sunlight energy and grow warm. This happens because the rule set says it will happen.

Saying that conscious entities have decision spaces and make choices should make this clear. The fact that this is a VR and everything exists within the LCS and thus exists based upon consciousness or thus are 'made of' consciousness is not the same thing as saying that plants ARE conscious or HAVE consciousness. Plants are not linked to IUOCs as their minds to make their decisions for the simple reason that it would be a waste of an IUOCs time as there being no decisions to make. The rule set defines it all.

Ted

Slorri, did you read the thread I linked?

That thread is specifically about this and solves it (to me anyway).

You should really read that thread, if you want any answer.

This is a great distinction Ted, thank you as always.
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.

There is no evidence that conscious entities appear and disappear, but there is no evidence of trees disappearing either. There is a mathematical probability that I can pass through a solid wall (a small probability) but if I did manage to pass through a solid wall, there would be no evidence of that either.

_________________
LOVE is the answer

peace
patrick

It simply speaks to the difference between a player and a prop, to me.
Love
Bette

_________________
All That Is
what is?
Consciousness.