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PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 8:10 pm 
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When sitting still or lying in meditation do you always 'look' at the back of your eyelids when your eyes are closed ?
I was doing this this morning and a little purple light was 'pulsing' in and out of my third eye view. There was only a very soft light coming into the bedroom. I suspect it was my hearts pulse but would like an opinion as I think my pulse seemed faster?
Does anybody use or recommend sleeping masks ?

Thanks'
Peter

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Last edited by Peter on Fri Sep 26, 2008 8:50 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 8:48 pm 
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Peter,

The idea is to shut out all stimuli and artifacts of PMR that distract you from existing as pure consciousness in the void. You are not supposed to be "doing" anything except existing and being aware of that existence. The doing comes later after the state of "point consciousness" is at your will, uninterrupted by thoughts, and steady.

Tom


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PostPosted: Fri Sep 26, 2008 8:55 pm 
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[quote="twcjr"]Peter,

Tom: You are not supposed to be "doing" anything except existing and being aware of that existence.

Peter:
Thanks for that Tom I just got it :-)
I have been at that 'point' of existence before so I know what you mean and should of had my own answer... sometimes the thinking mind tries to do it all ;-)

Thanks,
Peter
p.s. As Bette said in another post, thankyou for your time in replying to our questions. You are a top bloke :-) (Aussie/English for excellent individual)

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 8:00 am 
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Tom: The idea is to shut out all stimuli and artifacts of PMR that distract you from existing as pure consciousness in the void.

JoshM: Is the void you are referring to the same as what Bruce Moen calls the 3D Blackness?


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 10:35 am 
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JoshM,

I am not familiar with what Bruce Moen calls the 3D Blackness but the name sort of fits -- I would like "dimensionless blackness" better but this experience is not about space or visual color. It is not so much that one experiences blackness as it is that one experiences nothing (the void) except their own existence. With no awareness of ANY input to or from any of your senses, it is like the ultimate sensory deprivation chamber. Nothing but an awareness of existing and being aware -- i.e., the pure experience of being conscious with absolutely nothing else going on. A point (no sense of dimension) of consciousness existing within the void.

Tom C


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 1:08 pm 
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Tom what do you do once you get there?

Guess it was about 8 months ago after reading MBT, I was bound and determined to experience point consciousness, OOBE, or at least something. Think it was a Friday or Saturday night, didn't want to deal with work the next day. I listened to "Meditation", a hemysinc product from Monroe, and repeated one of your mantras in my head for about 2 hours. At that point my body felt as if it was expanding till there was nothing there, along with total darkness. It was incredibly easy to think in that state. The only sensations I had was the feeling something tunneled into my skull about where the third eye is suppose to be, and had a caffeine headache. I sat there experiencing the experience of it, but dropped out do to the headache. Felt as tho I had achieved my goal, but didn't know what to do with it. Any help would be much appreciated.

Thanks,

Shin


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 27, 2008 9:23 pm 
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Shinoki,

Indeed it does sound like you achieved your goal. Now, practice getting in and out of that state and just floating in the void until you can get there is a few minutes whenever you want to and stay as long as you like. Then, after familiarity and stability have been achieved, while in that state use you intent to communicate with nonphysical beings, or to practice healing for starters. more details on how to go about doing that are, i believe, scattered about in the discussion group somewhere.

Tom C


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 9:23 am 
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Tom: It is not so much that one experiences blackness as it is that one experiences nothing (the void) except their own existence. With no awareness of ANY input to or from any of your senses, it is like the ultimate sensory deprivation chamber.

JoshM: So would this be more like what Monroe described as Focus 10 - Mind Awake/Body Asleep?

Back when I was disciplined enough to get up after about 6 hours of sleep and attempt a lucid dream, I would be able to passively watch my body fall back asleep a few times. When this happened, it felt like my body "turned off" and I received no more sensory input. From there I used my intent to move around.
I had to overcome quite a bit of fear in order to allow this to progress - the first thing I thought of when my body turned off was whether or not I was still breathing. After a while, I got used to it and was able to push on.


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PostPosted: Sun Sep 28, 2008 1:39 pm 
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JoshM,

Yes, that is a close comparison. However, keep in mind that Monroe's hierarchy of focus levels are tools, and as such are arbitrary not fundamental.

Tom C


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PostPosted: Tue Sep 30, 2008 5:01 am 
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Thanks Tom, I'm really encouraged now. Was thinking of sticking too it till it becomes second nature. Wish I had mentioned the experience long ago, might of been a little further along by now... oh well.

Thanks again,

Shin


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 6:52 pm 
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Not to keep beating a dead horse, but I have been thinking a lot lately about Tom's void comments. I thought I remembered Focus 10 being described as the void, but ran across some things yesterday and noticed it wa Focus 15 that had been described as that.

From http://www.monroeinstitute.com/content. ... tent_id=55:
"Timeline encouraged us to explore the powerful stillness of Focus 15, a place many of us have perceived as the Void, a great emptiness where nothing much happens. "Sublime stillness" might be more accurate. When you truly embrace the emptiness even for a heartbeat.well, each one's experience is unique."

From http://www.dojopsi.info/forum/index.php?topic=190.0:
"Focus 15 is the Monroe term for a state of consciousness that is outside of time. All times and places are accessible from this state. A lot of people experience it as a blackness or void, kind of a primordial, womb-like experience. Some people like that, and some don't. I didn't much care for Focus 15 at first, because nothing ever seemed to happen there, unlike some other focus levels in which things just suddenly popped up without any effort or intention on my part. You have to learn how to kick-start things in Focus 15, how to navigate through it. Once you get the hang of it, you can use Focus 15 to explore other times, for example."

When I was at the Gateway Voyage in 2002 I think I got a brief glimpse of it, but nothing more.

I have a tangential question but I will ask it in the next post.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 7:00 pm 
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I am wondering why Tom doesn't recommend using Hemi-Sync to aid in getting operational to NPMR. Tom, along with Bruce Moen, and the person mentioned in this post viewtopic.php?f=5&t=2589 have all used Hemi-Sync to successfully access NPMR.

However, when giving advice, all 3 have simplified the process and, as far as I can tell, don't have people follow the same path they did. I was wondering why that is? I can understand that once you have become operational in NPMR and have a good grasp on how to access it, you simplify your personal methods and can switch to NPMR and back in an instant. Beginners aren't so lucky, so why not just have people use Hemi-Sync as training wheels until they become operational and then discard it?

Is it really that efficient to just follow the meditation advice in MBT? I am still doing that, but I was just thinking about this today while at work and decided to post the question.


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 7:33 pm 
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Hi Josh,

I just came across your post and have recently had some things happen while I was hemisynching. about 3 weeks ago I did not have the time or place to do daily meditation so I pulled out my apple nano and started hemisynching throughout the day, last week I started back my normal meditation and it wasn't as effective as it used to be, I couldn't reach the total thoughtless void state and it took me about 5 days of trying to meditate to get back into the flow, I don't know why this is but it was like my brain was looking for the hemisynch drug. Dont get me wrong, I lived off Hemisynch for several years and loved it, but after successfully learning to meditate on my own and seeing what the hemisync did to my progress makes me cringe at the thought of putting those ear buds back in my ear.

Have a good evening.

thynes


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 9:58 pm 
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JoshM,

Training wheels are a good description -- if you need them, by all means use them -- but note that Thynes was stuck -- his meditation was limited and he was completely unaware that was the case. One needs to know when to throw the crutches away, however, if you have never walked before, how can you know? All mediation training aids (techniques) fit in this same basket. Hemi-sync, being much more effective for the effort required than the others, is the easiest to become addicted to -- be careful not to get caught in a trap you cannot see or sense.

Tom C


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PostPosted: Tue Oct 14, 2008 11:19 pm 
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And thus, boy edge finished MBT. What a ride! Pages and pages total enjoyment culminating in the best lesson yet. Therefor returns to the most brilliant forum on the web.

Okay. Excuse me. Happy to be back. I've noticed that if you look at a single space for a few minuets or so the thing will start to have a glowing outline and then almost disappear. If you're really dedicated up to the twenty minuet stare there begins a swirling colorful amoeboid/explosion visuals as well as pin flashes (the term psychedelic comes to mind). Is this resonating with anybody?

I'm not convinced it's NMPR leakage. It may be some form of the mind grasping for data - as if its the mind's reaction to my suggesting it ignore physical feed and not possibly being afraid. Not positive. Though it seems the visuals might be slightly controllable or suggestible.



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