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 Post subject: Intent versus wanting?!
PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 11:33 am 
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Hi guys,
I am new here and that is my first post. I am reading My big toe now and watched a lot of youtube teachings.
Going forward on my path doing my on experience I happend to come to the question of my post.
I can see that Tom is using the word intent very often. For example while healing the intent is the driving force.
I found that I get confused between the intent and the cramping up from my ego holding a frequency of wanting.
To give you a picture about my problem.

Lets say you are tired. You get up from the sofa, switch of the TV and go to bed. While in bed a feeling comes hindering you to fall to sleep. Now the battle is on with the intent (wanting) to sleep and the not being able to fall asleep. More the person fights with what is, that is the state of not falling to sleep, he cramps up and is not able. But the intent is there, still it is not working. If the intent would not have been there he would still sit and watch TV.

I see falling to sleep must include a type of GRACE and TRUST. I havent noticed much yet that Tom is talking about these states of being, meaning Grace and trust.

I have the intent to sleep, I go and trust the process. Something picks me up and I sleep. The trouble only starts when the picking upp is not coming when I want it. Here the confusion is happening to me.

Other example: Two golfers. Both have intent to win the game. Otherwise they would not be there. One not only has his intent he too cramps up because of too much wanting and is not getting int he the "ZONE". With this I mean a state of flow. Egofree action. Where things are happening.

With healing I hit a wall. If the pains are terrible or a person I love is very sick. My wanting to help makes me cramp up and I am not getting into the zone. Intent I must have otherwise I would not try to heal.

I hope you got the picture of my problem and can teach me what I miss out. You could even point me into a direction of a book or something. There must be something out there holding a answer. I hoped to get some help from my guides. But alas! I guess I cramp up and hear nothing! ;-)

yours & and thanks for any kind of help and feedback
Thomas


Last edited by Thomas on Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:04 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 12:00 pm 
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Thomas,

I could not watch this again as I can't ever get Youtube to play through except in the middle of the night. But here is Tom talking about Intent. I tend to capitalize it as Intent when it is used with Tom's extended meaning instead of the more ususal, "I intend to go to the store this afternoon". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBr40Qk0D4A This is a Video from Tom 'on the beach' in Hawaii titled: Tom Campbell Q&A (5 of 8) Beach, Intent Defined.

Post again if this does not answer your questions. I could post more, but let's get it straight from Tom first.

Ted


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 2:37 pm 
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Quote:
Thomas,

I could not watch this again as I can't ever get Youtube to play through except in the middle of the night. But here is Tom talking about Intent. I tend to capitalize it as Intent when it is used with Tom's extended meaning instead of the more ususal, "I intend to go to the store this afternoon". http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=MBr40Qk0D4A This is a Video from Tom 'on the beach' in Hawaii titled: Tom Campbell Q&A (5 of 8) Beach, Intent Defined.

Post again if this does not answer your questions. I could post more, but let's get it straight from Tom first.

Ted

It was great! Thank you. I could see everything. I understood it with my spirit that intent is not seperate from being. I understood too that there is a blend of several things even wanting goes into it but maybe you could explain to me more about the egos doing. I know that the ego doesnt exist. That even a thought about an ego is a thought, meaning a concept. Still there is some energy produced and coming from concepts, believes etc producing wantings. If these wantings (needs) are not answered often they create frustration even hate and agression in the person wanting but not getting.

Now, how do I know that my longings, wantings, intents are genuin loved based and not part of a negative energy force? An ego playing humble, loving and kind only to keep going. I am sure you have met people being real kind and friendly but something is fishy about them. A kind of false, controlling friendliness.

I want to explore. I believe that my intents are right. I want meet my guides to learn, to see if my motives are right. But even my intentions are there, and I believe with my being. .....There is silence...I enjoy the silence but I would enjoy more the fellowship of my guides. Which havent shown up so far.

any ideas or thoughts! Can you read behind my lines if my english is not so good to explain. I am from Sweden!
yours
Thomas


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 02, 2013 9:49 pm 
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From Tom on the forum:
Intent, as used in MBT, is composed of several interrelated concepts. It is how one interfaces, communicates, and interacts with other individuals or with the consciousness system. It is the vehicle or mechanism for expression of a consciousness at the being level; thus it is the most fundamental expression of the ability, capacity and quality of an individual consciousness in its interaction with others. It does express an individual’s attitude, will and motivation (relative to interaction with others) at the being level.

You, at the dynamic interactive being level, are your intent. Your intent is the dynamic expression of you (your consciousness) that connects and interacts with whatever is beyond or outside of you (the larger consciousness system). In other words, your intent is the essence of you that interacts with all that is not you.

It is your intent that “moves data” in the consciousness system – i.e., that interacts, exchanges, and modifies information within the larger information system.

Intent is not a simple concept in MBT. It is the active personal projection of an individuated unit of consciousness at the being level (as opposed to the intellectual level) into the information field of existence (focused mental energy is one metaphor for that).

Intent is not a command, it is not demanding, though it can arrange reality to its will.


Let me just make a little point about word usage and interpretation. When you say "I'm choosing to be happy" you should mean that now you ARE happy. The emphasis needs to be on the "BE," which is about what you are, not on the intellectual action of "CHOOSING," which is about what you do. In other words, the act of choosing -- making more productive higher quality choices should be a reflection of the fact of BEING a better higher quality person, not just acting like one because you think that is a good thing to do. The quality of a being is expressed directly by its intent -- the intent of the being is expressed by the choices it makes. The flow is from quality to choices.

If the emphasis is placed on "CHOOSING" it can be interpreted to be more of an intellectual effort. An intellectual effort to make better more love based choices is good and it may well lead to being a higher quality being -- but not necessarily. Acting better without growing to be better is certainly civilizing and beneficial for everyone around you but it is not to be confused with being better or better being. Even class acts grow old and eventually slip away if they do not actually represent the inner being of the actor. Better, more productive behavior is a result or by-product of reaching a more important goal. You express your clarity on this point when you say: "And all with a 'glad to' attitude".

A good start is to be, through diligent practice, an accomplished meditator. That is, be able to find and remain in that state where you have shut out all the ego and background noise and exist only as a single point of consciousness (awareness) floating in an empty silent void. At that point you are nothing but intent just waiting to be focused. The action of focusing is an act of free will expressing purpose and goal. Now, while remaining in that state, you can focus that intent on growing your being, exploring NPMR, or healing a physical body in need of some assistance. Don't expect anything — expectation (a function of ego) should not exist in that still quiet place — be grateful for whatever tiny increment you get. Eventually, with much practice, you will be able to access that state even while driving home or talking to someone.
viewtopic.php?f=8&t=5050&p=24526&hilit= ... pts#p24526


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 2:36 am 
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Thomas,

I will also link you to something which I wrote up and which Tom had me post on the bulletin board. Perhaps it will be of use to you. Intent, as Tom uses it, is a difficult concept and as a 'being level' function is not truly available to us consciously. viewtopic.php?f=18&t=4998 Here is a link to a thread and posts by Tom from the board 'FAQ' section, possibly including what Linda has posted above. viewtopic.php?f=21&t=4992

Regarding communicating with your guides, or better with your guidance, this is really a complicated and individual matter with your guides. I once set up a specific forum, Communication within Consciousness Space, to try to discuss this general concept but it was never picked up on by board members. viewforum.php?f=20 Guidance can frequently be seen as coming from the LCS and not necessarily from specific guides as IUOCs. It comes in many forms, even unconsciously. I have experienced myself, relatively early on, communication with individuals who would provide answers to my questions but gradually quit providing clear answers as in yes/no or other specifics. At one time, they even identified themselves to me as (grandfather) bear, beaver and wolverine, complete with pop up visuals. It is difficult for them to provide the kind of discrete communication that we expect in PMR languages. As you gain skill with receiving their guidance, they tend to provide ideas as whole concepts rather than language based discussion. It is easier for them and can convey much more information, once you can reach the point of accepting it more readily. In my case, I would frequently have to 'sleep' on answers to questions here on the board when I first started doing this at Tom's request. I would not know the answer to give to a question, perhaps over night or perhaps after a nap, I suddenly knew what to say and without any specific memory of a dream or such source. Then it progressed to the point where I would not need this 'sleep' but could just start writing it out and what I needed to say would just be there as needed. Sort of like channeling but without any channeled persona being involved. I came to trust this information and Tom never stepped in to correct anything as being in error. I hope that this gives you some insights to apply to your future experience. But how it will specifically develop for you is a matter of you and your guides and how this communication develops on an individual basis.

Ted


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 5:33 am 
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Thank you both for your kindness to answer me! I got a lot of knowleadge out of your posts.
It was interessting what you Ted wrote about the way of communication with the guidience.
you wrote: ...they tend to provide ideas as whole concepts rather than language based discussion I experienced this several important times in my life and it was always very very special and like you said a whole concept in one go. It had a feeling of ....AHA Heureka... and even if the truth sometimes was tuff, it changed my life for the better and made me free.

Where is my problem, or the suposed problem of mine: After reading in Toms books. I got the impression that I am not the passive part but can be aktiv. He choose to explore and he choose to meet guides, he choose with intent to grow. I was living in the field of GRACE. I was passive and wondered about an action who can have intent but is not ego based. You see when the was a lot of ego wanting in me, I started to suffer and lot people around me. When I woke up to some truth the guides showed me I was free of it and let other people free. I came then into a state of watchful awareness. Much like a person sitting happy at the beach doing nothing, needing nothing watching the waves roll in. Thats ok for a while until I thought too... life is where the action is. Starting to move out of acceptence, being in acceptence and still holding an intent without falling into the egoistical trapps is my challange.
I enjoyed the moments in my life with the Heureka teachings of the guides so much that I would like to meet with them and have a very much talking situation of me putting forth question and I am getting a answer. It looks to me like the guides dont think I need that. That is ok with me. But doesnt this makes me again passiv? I can go back into awareness and sit and do nothing but that is not the impression I got from Toms work.

Its so hard to explain but I am sure you get the spirit of that I want to say.

yours
Thomas


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 6:54 am 
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Quote:
Hi guys,
I am new here and that is my first post. I am reading My big toe now and watched a lot of youtube teachings.
Going forward on my path doing my on experience I happend to come to the question of my post.
I can see that Tom is using the word intent very often. For example while healing the intent is the driving force.
I found that I get confused between the intent and the cramping up from my ego holding a frequency of wanting.
To give you a picture about my problem.

Lets say you are tired. You get up from the sofa, switch of the TV and go to bed. While in bed a feeling comes hindering you to fall to sleep. Now the battle is on with the intent (wanting) to sleep and the not being able to fall asleep. More the person fights with what is, that is the state of not falling to sleep, he cramps up and is not able. But the intent is there, still it is not working. If the intent would not have been there he would still sit and watch TV.
Most of modern lives are lived at the conscious level of mental intention, getting ideas and wanting them and forcing them to happen. Falling asleep though is an autonomic process arising from the biological or R-complex level, so it is, like many things, most effective when we do not direct or force it from the mental level.

Then falling asleep rather becomes a process of figuring out this autonomic process. Getting technical here...for me, a sleep-friendly snack and leaving the TV on, with a sleep timer, eyes closed in sleep position, separate bedrooms, low lighting levels in evening, works perfectly. Construction earmuffs available should any distracting noise arise, such as an old snoring dog.

Not watching TV steps into sensory deprivation and the initial emotional bush whacking that precedes or ramps into a non-mantric meditation process, which usually involves facing issues and fears not fully digested earlier in the day. A meditator might have less of this challenge, having worked through this digestion in their daily meditation "ramp in" process.
Quote:
I see falling to sleep must include a type of GRACE and TRUST. I havent noticed much yet that Tom is talking about these states of being, meaning Grace and trust.
Tom does not generally get into Christian metaphors. My belief is that this is because it is not in his background, is not an area of attraction or curiosity for him, this is part of his design and construction, and that this is a good thing as he is in the New Wine Skin business and the local western cultural gravity of Christianity is too large a force to be associated with, especially given the pollution of the original teachings and the belief and ignorance in the scientific community, his primary target.
Quote:
I have the intent to sleep, I go and trust the process. Something picks me up and I sleep. The trouble only starts when the picking upp is not coming when I want it. Here the confusion is happening to me.

Other example: Two golfers. Both have intent to win the game. Otherwise they would not be there. One not only has his intent he too cramps up because of too much wanting and is not getting int he the "ZONE". With this I mean a state of flow. Egofree action. Where things are happening.
Yes, as above, the mental level interacts indirectly, like connecting the dots between practise and results, but the act of the swing is a letting go at the mental level and letting autonomic processes take over. In this way, golf is good practise for letting go to the other force, which is our organic "love impulse" (better Intent) which arises out of the right hemisphere.

We suspend disbelief and let our higher self take the wheel, which often means doing illogical acts, and then we experience the spiritual feedback, it feels good, so we are a little more open to stepping aside and letting our higher self direct our lives going forward. I think meditation is investing in opening the lines of communication to our higher self.
Quote:
With healing I hit a wall. If the pains are terrible or a person I love is very sick. My wanting to help makes me cramp up and I am not getting into the zone. Intent I must have otherwise I would not try to heal.
yes, our own fears and attachment interfere with letting go, which is why surgeons don't operate on people close to them.
Quote:
I hope you got the picture of my problem and can teach me what I miss out. You could even point me into a direction of a book or something. There must be something out there holding a answer. I hoped to get some help from my guides. But alas! I guess I cramp up and hear nothing! ;-)
one can do word searches on Tom's material in this forum as well as the online trilogy.

click on "Members" at the top of this page, then TWCJR, search user's postings.

you can also search the Trilogy
http://books.google.com/books?id=RYHtBP ... nt&f=false

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 8:44 am 
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Quote:

It was great! Thank you. I could see everything. I understood it with my spirit that intent is not seperate from being.
I think of Quality of Consciousness (QoC) as being a noun, a "stock", a computer code printout, and one usage of MBT intent is QoC forming a general goal, like, intent is QoC as a verb, as a computer code execution.

Tom mostly uses the word to refer to specific intent arising from the IOUC's quality, at PMR DELTA(t) slice decision forks in the road, of significance. The significance of intent is that it is more important than the decision you actually make and the action you actually do.

The classic model you will see in the Trilogy is

QoC->intent->decision->action->result->feedback->QoC change

intent and QoC are directly referencing each other at the fundamental level, and

decision->action->result is limited to the VR level, and is therefore not fundamental

Feedback in the MBT sense is the linkage between your intent and how your intent feels or digests after the fact

We get primordial feedback from touching our hand on a stove, pragmatic feedback when we don't study for an examination, and we get spiritual feedback when we are intentionally mean to someone. MBT relates to the latter feedback.
Quote:
I understood too that there is a blend of several things even wanting goes into it but maybe you could explain to me more about the egos doing. I know that the ego doesnt exist.
I think of ego as operating from the metric of what only goes on in the little world between our ears, rather than calibrating our intent and decisions to the matrix of players on the stage of our lives. One result of this little world view is investing in a false front of impressiveness and overinvestment in controlling others, rather than an authentic strategy of authentic connection and cooperation.

Authentic connection and cooperation is not sacrifice, it is efficiency according to how the para-universe actually is.
Quote:
That even a thought about an ego is a thought, meaning a concept. Still there is some energy produced and coming from concepts, believes etc producing wantings. If these wantings (needs) are not answered often they create frustration even hate and agression in the person wanting but not getting.
Its like the monkey with his fist around the banana in the coconut trap...letting go releases the banana. Reducing ego and dialing up cooperation and authentic connection actually works better at getting what you want and need, which of course are very different things.
Quote:
Now, how do I know that my longings, wantings, intents are genuin loved based and not part of a negative energy force?
You can't really, and I believe the more mature you are, more skeptical you are regarding your own intent. Like golf, I believe MBT points to letting go of the spiritual materialism of assessing your own progress and quality, and rather being with the swing, entraining on the environment...all of it.

As a twist on "shut up and calculate", rather, "shut up and golf".

or rather, "shut up and be".
Quote:
An ego playing humble, loving and kind only to keep going. I am sure you have met people being real kind and friendly but something is fishy about them. A kind of false, controlling friendliness.
Yes, Tom would say "Acting loving" rather than "being loving". Maybe passive aggressive applies here as well. That being said, acting loving and civil is better than being evil, like intentionally harming and controlling others for the narrow fun of it. Its a starting point and the nature of most fundamentalist or protestant models.
Quote:
I want to explore. I believe that my intents are right. I want meet my guides to learn, to see if my motives are right. But even my intentions are there, and I believe with my being. .....There is silence...I enjoy the silence but I would enjoy more the fellowship of my guides. Which havent shown up so far.
If you have not had any overt PSI experiences, I would suggest setting those expectations aside and rather try out MBT as a life philosophy and psychological system first, and gently learn about PSI life without being grasping regarding a specific desire. You are primarily constructed to interact with this PMR and its FWAU avatars, so I would suggest focusing on doing that better.

The system will find its own way to let you know this is not an elaborate act of imagination.

If you want to make a push into PSI, apart from following Tom's specific instructions on point of consciousness, maybe read Bruce Moen (a separate but closer provenance from Monroeism) or visit TMI (the mother ship which Tom has gently separated from). From your location in Europe, you may be able to more conveniently interact with the Raduga people (a new and intriguing OBE focused sprout) at OBE4U.com and maybe go to a Raduga workshop.

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PostPosted: Sun Mar 03, 2013 1:38 pm 
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I want to thank you all! I have a lot to read and experiment with.
I learned a lot and will start now to eat the pudding so to speak. If I get stuck or have a question I will come
back again. For now its time to grog it and eat the knowleadge.

yours
Thomas


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