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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 11:58 am 
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How do you know it is your IUOC, and not a guide, or the LCS in general? You get information but how do you know where it originates?


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:26 pm 
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How do you know it is your IUOC, and not a guide, or the LCS in general?
It doesn’t matter. You can break it up and label it however you want and how you do so defines your experience. Maybe it’s God. :) unless that concept scares you of course. ;)


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 12:34 pm 
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You are the one saying that you are always in contact with your IOUC. And I am asking you how do you know the information you are getting is from your IUOC. You can't is the answer. Any answer you are giving yourself is from belief.

It is the value of the information that is important and not the origination.


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 1:15 pm 
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You are the one saying that you are always in contact with your IOUC. And I am asking you how do you know the information you are getting is from your IUOC. You can't is the answer. Any answer you are giving yourself is from belief.

It is the value of the information that is important and not the origination.
Yes the value of the information is what is important. I could just as easily say the information comes from me. The data has the meaning that I assign to it, it has no inherent meaning on its own. I assign the meaning to the data it thus becomes information when I have assigned meaning. It’s value, is directly dependent on how I define it. Sometimes I accept the meaning(information) of the data that society/culture has assigned, it is sometimes necessary but it could just as easily be defined differently.
In my early life I accepted many of my parents beliefs and definitions, those belief and definitions were not optimal, they created a lot of suffering for themselves.

Everything that isn’t pure conscious awareness is constructed through belief systems and definitions(labeling). You may hold whatever beliefs and definitions that you desire, your experience will be based on them. Your attempt to label and define others limits your ability to understand them. It also limits your ability to understand MBT. This dose not make you wrong but it does limit you.

I said that where it comes from doesn’t matter. Why did you ignore that?

You are fooling yourself.

You are an authority of nothing but you.


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:03 pm 
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Good paragraph on information. There is no need to be rude.

TOM:
It is not that you are an ignorant child while your over-soul is a brilliant enlightened entity. Your over-soul has a larger perspective than you do because it is not focused (trapped) in the PMR rule-set. But it does not necessarily have lower average entropy than you do (unless your consciousness quality has been degenerating while in PMR).
viewtopic.php?f=13&t=2668&p=3371&hilit= ... iant#p3371


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 2:12 pm 
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I apologize if I came off as rude. My intent is now and has always been to help, with the goal of freedom.

I want this for my self and for all others. I accept what is with a knowing that it doesn’t always have to be so.

:)


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:03 pm 
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Then take a big pitcher of ice water and pour it over the person who is remote viewing, the person who is having a dream, the person who is having a lucid dream, the person who is having an OBE, and see how that works out.
If you did not create a problem for the explorer while in the alternate state, it would no doubt shock the poor thing back threw the filter of the avatar.
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If all non-primary data streams, just like the PMR one, weren't filtered through the FWAU's ego, fears, expectations, etc., then all NDEs would be exactly the same. And everyone would have exactly the same experiences in similar circumstances. And we know that isn't true.
This is where we differ and where you deviate from Tom's explanation. The fear, ego and expectations reside in the avatar. The person who has the NDE is attached to fear, ego and expectations. The explorer likely has detached from her fears, ego and expectations and thus operates at the being the level in sync with the intellectual level thereby releasing the PMR filter. This explorer is thus constrained by the NPMR rule set. However, unless the explorer is an ADEPT or MASTER, as long as she lives, she must return to the avatar through the PMR filter and its rule set. She now has the potential to operate in both realities under both rule sets.
Quote:
Your NPMR experiences are especially driven by how you filter your data stream.
This does not make sense.


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 6:57 pm 
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Quote:
VB: Yes but the PMR data stream does not constrain your FWAU.
Quote:
Sainbury: The FWAU's avatar is most definitely constrained by the ruleset of the PMR.
Quote:
JDJR: The FWAU is not subject to the PMR rule set.
While there are many connotations by people about FWAU as a soul within an avatar - The FWAU can be essentially represented as the the interface to the data-stream.

When you "incarnate" to a specific data-stream - you are constrained to the data-stream with its rule-set and in this case, our human avatar brain that our consciousness is filtered through.

This means that the FWAU literally represents a constraint.


Quote:
TOM: The FWAU (soul) is the interface (receives the PMR data stream) within the consciousness system that is committed to a specific PMR virtual trainer experience packet and the higher-self is the connection between the PMR character and the IUOC/LCS


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:34 pm 
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Quote:
You can experience all of these modes as you are consciousness. All of the modes are you. You can catch yourself in each of these modes.

This is the nuance here:

While consciousness has no limitations fundamentally, it does exist within subsets which represent limitations and also there is consciousness designated for certain functions.

In terms of FWAU, you are a fragment interfacing and based within a specifc VR/data-stream. Even when you go out of body as a FWAU, you are experiencing the NPMR and larger reality through the PMR reference frame which again, is your base reality until you die and the FWAU goes away. It is not about getting rid of PMR beliefs to fully experience the NPMR, it is that the VR data-streams also structures your experience here. What you experience in NPMR that theoretically may not be within PMR interpretation will not be consciously available to your PMR brain anyway. The brain represents constraints too, a brain molded from the ruleset of the data-stream and designed to interpret the VR in a certain way from long-term PMR evolution.


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 8:46 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
VB: Yes but the PMR data stream does not constrain your FWAU.
Quote:
Sainbury: The FWAU's avatar is most definitely constrained by the ruleset of the PMR.
Quote:
JDJR: The FWAU is not subject to the PMR rule set.
While there are many connotations by people about FWAU as a soul within an avatar - The FWAU can be essentially represented as the the interface to the data-stream.

When you "incarnate" to a specific data-stream - you are constrained to the data-stream with its rule-set and in this case, our human avatar brain that our consciousness is filtered through.

This means that the FWAU literally represents a constraint.


Quote:
TOM: The FWAU (soul) is the interface (receives the PMR data stream) within the consciousness system that is committed to a specific PMR virtual trainer experience packet and the higher-self is the connection between the PMR character and the IUOC/LCS
This is an excellent observation. But I am not convinced by the evidence that the soul is the constraint. Although, you have corroborated my assertion that the soul is not constrained by this PMR rule set. The soul receives the PMR data stream.


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:00 pm 
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Quote:
Quote:
You can experience all of these modes as you are consciousness. All of the modes are you. You can catch yourself in each of these modes.

This is the nuance here:

While consciousness has no limitations fundamentally, it does exist within subsets which represent limitations and also there is consciousness designated for certain functions.
Yes, I agree.
Quote:
In terms of FWAU, you are a fragment interfacing and based within a specifc VR/data-stream. Even when you go out of body as a FWAU, you are experiencing the NPMR and larger reality through the PMR reference frame which again, is your base reality until you die and the FWAU goes away. It is not about getting rid of PMR beliefs to fully experience the NPMR, it is that the VR data-streams also structures your experience here. What you experience in NPMR that theoretically may not be within PMR interpretation will not be consciously available to your PMR brain anyway. The brain represents constraints too, a brain molded from the ruleset of the data-stream and designed to interpret the VR in a certain way from long-term PMR evolution.
Well, the problem here is that the brain is not relevant to the issue. Tom confirms this and it is confirmed otherwise on this forum. Review the video I attached in a previous post on this thread. Further, the elimination of fear is a factor that runs through all of the models and the NDE's. You do not go out of body as an FWAU. You go out of body as an avatar.


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:09 pm 
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Quote:
But I am not convinced by the evidence that the soul is the constraint
The FWAU is a constraint upon consciousness because it is bound to a specific function to only interpret a specific data-stream. This data-stream the FWAU interprets also structures the VR. When the specific data-stream is no longer being interpreted - then FWAU has effectively "died" or uploaded.

So the FWAU is a constraint upon consciousness to interface a specific datastream and further the FWAU itself is constrained by the VR ruleset of the avatar it is incarnated to.
Quote:
Although, you have corroborated my assertion that the soul is not constrained by this PMR rule set.
Please pay attention to the nuance before you pat yourself on the back. You were being argumentive with Sainbury(like always) for this discrepency you missed. Of course consciousess is not inherently bound to a PMR ruleset but in this instance it is. Please refer to the concept of "incarnation".

Quote:
Well, the problem here is that the brain is not relevant to the issue.
What is the, "issue here" please provide a time stamp to your issue, I am not going through a 40 minute video to try and figure out which part you're referring to.
Whatever your assumption is, I may be able to add nuance.


Quote:
You do not go out of body as an FWAU. You go out of body as an avatar.
Avatar does not exist independent of the FWAU unless it's an NPC, because the FWAU is INCARNATED here, then NPMR data-stream is interpreted from the base VR it's incarnated in.


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:22 pm 
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Quote:
While there are many connotations by people about FWAU as a soul within an avatar - The FWAU can be essentially represented as the the interface to the data-stream.

When you "incarnate" to a specific data-stream - you are constrained to the data-stream with its rule-set and in this case, our human avatar brain that our consciousness is filtered through.

This means that the FWAU literally represents a constraint.
I don’t totally disagree. It’s a valid perspective. However, the FWAU is not located within anything other than the LCS which has no inherent dimension or it would also be true to say it occupies all dimensions, the avatar is virtual the FWAU is not.

How constrained the FWAU is, is up to it in cooperation with the LCS. Your FWAU is not constrained by the laws of physics as they are commonly understood.


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:30 pm 
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Quote:
the avatar is virtual the FWAU is not.
Not my statement, re-read.
Quote:
Your FWAU is not constrained by the laws of physics as they are commonly understood.
Not my statement, re-read.


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 Post subject: Re: QOC + Related topics
PostPosted: Tue Jul 16, 2019 9:44 pm 
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Quote:
This means that the FWAU literally represents a constraint.
What constraint are you referring to? In my experience there aren’t much in the way of constraints when out of body, wether operating in PMR or NPMR.

The only constraints I see are interpreting metaphors which is a limitation of the transmission of experience through language, the experience remains what it is unless the experiencer redefines it through a different belief system.


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