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PostPosted: Wed Jan 14, 2009 10:07 pm 
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Thanks all for your replies. You are all more versed in the background to this than I am. I have some catching up to do, but the Whitworth paper was very reassuring, even though he hasn't got to the next stage with the consciousness connection, or, perhaps at least, won't go public with any such notions - for the reasons of professional 'credibility' which you all describe. But, as you imply Bette, a Truth once out into consciousness, will stay out and grow, however long it may take. Congratulations, btw, on undertaking your academic project; I'm not sure how I'd do at my time of life, tackling something on a similar scale....another of my self-limiting fears, I suspect!

Like you, Roland, Whitworth's elegant phrase and logic impressed me very much, and I was thinking of all the parallels with MBT as I read it. There are some interesting-looking literature references there too, which I think I'll follow up.

You got me right of course, Ramon, Whitworth's mental 'connection' to MBT was the sort I was wondering about, but I agree with Ted that he would be reticent about registering his opinions except in private. We will have to keep a watch for any possible developments.

Arthur

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PostPosted: Tue Aug 04, 2009 9:56 pm 
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A new Whitworth VR paper: http://brianwhitworth.com/BW-VRT2.pdf
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Bette

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2009 6:07 am 
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Thanks for finding and posting that, Bette! I've saved it for reading asap, but just glimpsing page 1, it seems he also already has three more new papers planned for the future. Great stuff!

Arthur

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PostPosted: Wed Aug 05, 2009 12:13 pm 
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You are welcome Arthur.
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Bette

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 5:19 pm 
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Hi all posted on here as seemed sort of relevant to Brians work
Type Gregory Chaitin Lecture Lisbon 2004 into youtube and a nice lecture on digital physics can be found
Also New Scientist had an article last week postulating it is gravity waves that collapse the probability wave in quantum mechanics - sounds kind of boring to me -I prefer consciousness!They cant prove it of course yet - another theory

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PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 7:06 pm 
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Andy,

Thank you for posting about Gregory Chaitin. Here is a link to the beginning of that lecture: http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=svzGGHdqst8 I find it most annoying and unfortunate that postings on YouTube are never numbered so the rest of a sequence, as in the rest of this lecture, are available. His thinking is most interesting to me. I think he should perhaps be included in the resources section of the bulletin board for our reference. Is there anyone motivated to take the time to search out the series of links to allow viewing his lectures, apparently more than one being available there, in complete form? I will then post them there. Wikipedia has an article about him with two of his publications available as PDF downloads. I believe that his work might well be of value in understanding the reality of Consciousness Space.

Ted


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PostPosted: Wed Nov 25, 2009 7:22 pm 
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edited out bad links

This is very interesting. Here are some related resources.
Leibnitz: http://www.maths.tcd.ie/pub/HistMath/Pe ... bnitz.html

http://plus.maths.org/issue37/features/omega/
http://www.cs.auckland.ac.nz/~chaitin/

Very interesting, Fredkin did digital philosophy?
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Bette

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Last edited by bette on Thu Nov 26, 2009 10:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 26, 2009 3:55 am 
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Cheers Bette and Ted,
Happy Thanksgiving I believe!

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PostPosted: Thu Nov 26, 2009 10:07 am 
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Yes, and Happy Day of Thanks Andy to you and yours.
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Bette

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PostPosted: Sat Dec 25, 2010 2:20 pm 
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Bump, because I ran into the "Universe Solved" book and searched to see if it had been mentioned here, it had.
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Bette

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PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 9:36 am 
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It`s about something I found in Brian Whitworth`s Chapter 1:

http://brianwhitworth.com/BW-VRT1.pdf page 6 §4

Quote: If solipsism is a one player game then virtual realism is a massively multi-player one, with every photon, electron and quark a “player”, not just sentient beings. Each is a program entity interacting on the processing network of space, with every information overload a physical event. Unlike solipsism, this virtual world has no gaps or view history to calculate, as no tree can fall in a forest unseen because the ground it hits “sees” it. This allows for the realism that solipsism denies.

How does that fit in with Tom`s theory when he discusses the classical "tree in the forest". As I understand for BW its enough that the ground collects the data. So it isn`t only sentient beings that can do that.

I hope that its ok posting my question in this old thread.

Anna


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PostPosted: Sat Mar 08, 2014 2:40 pm 
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Hello Anna,
I see it as an interesting alternative metaphor. Both Brian's and Tom's explanations seem to work. Brian puts a kind of minimal sentience at level of the the particle (or even the quark), rather than at the level of an animal. Since consciousness is in all things, that seems a valid position -after all, TBC is sentient. Tom's model does not go down that route because he takes into account the additional factor that particles have no decision space (or if you like -they are programmed and determined). One could imagine (like Brian) that particles have the ability to register and record data, but do not have enough sentience through free will to affect or change events.


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 8:15 am 
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Hi vzam!

Yes I see it in that way too, yet Tom said: "Brian and I are on the same sheet of music ... we are independently exploring the nature of PMR from opposite ends. Fortunately for both of us, we agree completely on all the fundamentals".
But maybe this issue isn`t included in the fundamentals, I am not sure.

Here is the link for the quote above.
viewtopic.php?f=9&t=8133

Anna


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PostPosted: Sun Mar 09, 2014 12:20 pm 
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OK Anna. Perhaps also, we should not forget that for Tom PMR particles don't exist physically - they're virtual, and expressed as probabilities until a sentient intelligence demands data, whereupon they appear to our senses (or our instruments) as objects. Brian, who is trying to support a PMR theory, has to assume that reality, though computed, may actually be (in a sense) physical information. A difference of emphasis, I suppose. Brian will discuss his ideas about human beings in a later Chapter of his theory. Should be interesting!


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PostPosted: Mon Mar 10, 2014 5:16 am 
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Maybe it is as you say, a difference of emphasis. Since Physics isn`t my subject I only try to reason on what I think I understand.
As far as I can see in Brian`s "virtual reality hypothesis" everything physical is virtual (so even particles), while the quantum world is the only reality.
Quote from chp.1:
"In virtual realism (1.2d), the physical world is a construct created by quantum processing, so there
is still a real world out there, but the physical world isn’t it. It is now just an interface generated on
demand by a more fundamental quantum reality."

Interesting about Brian`s new chapter. Did you get this information on his website?

Anna


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