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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 4:58 pm 
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So if the Virtual Realities all of PMR and NPMR exist as in a 3-dimensional simulation or projection in the mind, then what does that say about the dimension of consciousness space? Does our 3-d realities come from a 2-D net. Or is consciousness space 3-D too? Does it have no (0) dimensions made up of endless points?

As it is a real thing it must have a dimensionality, meaning the RWW Indra's net is actually 3-dimensional and an on going fractal, just unexperienceable by the IUOC unless the LCS gives you the data.


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 5:19 pm 
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I believe Tom states that physical/nonphysical, or dimensionality, in your words, is a matter of perspective.


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 8:31 pm 
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NPMR is non-physical to us - it has time but not inherently spacial matter. Spacial matter is an "experiential option" to beings of consciousness in NPMR.


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 8:54 pm 
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Remember Tom's vast number of reality cells and the data interacting within them. The LCS as information system. That is where every VR exists and also the LCS and The One Consciousness in its present developed form of AUM. The Union of all IUOCs interacting over the LCS which IS AUM. Also a subset is The Big Computer. TBC generates the experience of existing in PMR and also NPMR by time sharing which data is sent to each individual IUOC over the RWW to generate each avatar's experience within each VR. Also the experience of being AUM by further time sharing between these computers/IUOCs.

It's explained in Tom Campbell's Wiki in a Model of Reality which I wrote and Tom approved and contributed to years ago. Repeated many times but still apparently invisible to many of you. This is what I am working to expand in the books I'm trying to finish and other projects including a working simulation made with a gaming platform.

Ted


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 9:29 pm 
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Ted I have read the model and here it says: We do not know the geometry of the configuration of the reality cells. From future knowledge yet to be discussed and the one specific previous reference to a particular geometry already studied for a CA, we assume for simplicity of discussion a 2 dimensional plane advancing into the third dimension as time represented by state changes of the automaton.

From the beginning of time page on wiki.

If the reality cells are 2 dimensional then it has an aspect of holographic principle, just data stored in 2d.

Instead of redirecting me it would be much simpler to say i dont know or yes it has no (0) dimensionality no space. So it is just no-thing just consciousness.

A simple yes or no answer is required if you dont know you just state what you think would be the most likely possibility.


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 10:00 pm 
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We have no way to get to this information or observe it directly. We can only look for ways to explain the characteristics observed. The only degree and way to observe this I have done in the traditional way known as Indra's Net. This matches Tom Campbell's model. There are still things that don't match, specifically the 3 data bases which would require that you be able to travel both forwards in time and backwards in time to reach both past and future data. The one clue to that which we have is from quantum computing, where the 'bits' are quantum, but I don't know anything about that field and haven't had time to study it. It does seem the way where we might be able to explain what must happen to get observed results. But this is not anything that we know and may never know other than as a way in which this might work. I'm trying to provide ways in which science can further explore Tom Campbell's explanation/model of reality when it becomes accepted as explaining reality.

From PMR research, Dr. David Keirsey in this case, is where I found the evidence by which we can see that the 12 personality types derived from Aristotle make sense as existing within our IUOC as it does not pass down within families human genetics. IUOCs don't link to avatars based on genetics.

From Tom's original materials in his books, I expanded how VRs would produce what we observe here in PMR and from which Tom pointed out that this explained QM and its coming directly from the nature of VRs of the PMR type. This is how you have to proceed by expanding your understanding from what we know to what effects it might produce for the functioning of avatars in VRs. You have to work back and forth from what you know to what it means in terms of how the LCS and VRs work.

Also remember that I am speaking to more than one person at a time and into the future so I repeat things that I have already said to you again.

Ted


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PostPosted: Tue May 15, 2018 10:51 pm 
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I appreciate the response and i didnt know you answered for future people. So its just left to speculation. I wasn't considering time as a dimension though because it is just a measurement of information exchange. So we could also speculate a higher dimensiona ala 11 dimension string theory just without the strings.

So now the discussion could be which would be must likely. A fractal pattern 3d reality cells projecting 3d VR but it wouldnt be space as we know it as it would be nonlocal and acausal like quantum mechanics. A simple 2d information like hologram projecting 3d reality. Or it could be a higher dimension projecting like a tesseract.

It is also very interesting two see a high dimensional projection in 2d as it looks like RWW or Indras net of various nodes connected as one.and it resembles mandalas and cymatics.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:7-cube_t0.svg
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/E8_(mathematics)
https://goo.gl/images/CPkxM3


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 2:42 am 
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We also have some principles to go on. One being that the LCS uses the most parsimonious approach. Another is that IUOCs exist as the functional part of the LCS and are what does the work so how must they be ordered, arranged most simply, to create the desired result. So although Tom Campbell uses the metaphor of the three data bases, to actually have a data base as we think of a digital data base in PMR would require that many IUOCs would be taken from functioning in the Union of AUM to manage the data bases and that a lot of traffic over the RWW would be required just to reference our own individual memory as an avatar in a VR. Obviously an inefficient way to manage this data. So thus we arrive at the idea that the 3 data bases are actually managed by the one IUOC to which they apply.

The future probable data base is a continuing stream of messages over the RWW coming to each individual IUOC to manage by selecting the and reacting to each incoming message, either to accept it as the IUOC's choice for that avatar or to reject it (or them) so that it becomes the past unactualized data base. The past actualized data base can then, as the most commonly to be accessed and used as our avatar memory directly by each IUOC who needs it directly as was previously being speculated about. The most efficient way to manage these data bases for them to exist and to require the simplest access process and no IUOC is thus lost to functioning as part of the Union of IUOCs that is AUM. Hard to understand as a metaphor compared to just calling it a data base, but most realistic in terms of using the simplest process to create the desired result. Do you see how you can work your way through the logic of these concepts?

We end up with a fractal reality because we must create a network of Systems within which we keep the travel distance for data over the RWW short enough so that information from one side of the 'System' does not lose synchronization with data from the other side of the System. We can't lose consistence of arrival times so that the sequence of the data representing PMR for an avatar gets mixed up in terms of its order relative to the time sequence of all IUOCs with which it interacts within the System. So that even though the speed of data over the RWW is vastly fast, there are limits to the possible size of a System to maintain data coherence, thus allowing coherent communication within a System between any give pair of IUOCs/avatars and also within TBC for that System for the same reasons.

We don't know what data structure modeling is used to create the experience of the VR for an avatar. That is an eventual problem to be resolved by PMR science and it will not really affect Tom Campbell's Model of Reality. Unfortunately we cannot 'peek' and see how the VR is put together to appear as it does to each avatar via the messages from TBC over the RWW.

Is it gradually falling into place now? How you can work your way through to an understanding starting with just a few design principles?

Ted


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 8:19 am 
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Did you take a look at the pages that I posted? It is possible that the reality cells evolved to higher dimensions?

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Uniform_7-polytope
https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of ... _compounds


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 9:57 am 
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I think the most likely possibility is that the information system, the LCS is a high dimensional structure of reality cells as it is possible in math, it is a higher dimensional computer. I think it is a very PMR thought or belief to think for simplicity that the reality cells evolved like cellular automata in 2d. It can explore all possibilities and all states. It comes from a place or potential that is all possibilities math shows that is likely possible that it explored and evolved to higher dimensions.

Another interesting link that shows how mathematicians used algebraic topology, to map the connections of neurons in 11 dimensions.
https://www.sciencealert.com/science-di ... dimensions


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 12:45 pm 
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You can go around in circles for the rest of your life with that approach. We do know from observation that the LCS normally takes the simplest route to a result. You will never be able to go there and see if any of your guesses is the truth. But have fun guessing if that is your proclivity.

Ted


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 3:22 pm 
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Beyond concepts such as space, cells etc., and at the end of the chain of "what is that made of? and what is that made of? and what is that made of?", you reach the fractal of existence. This is the foundation. The fractal is self-defined and evolves by continually defining itself, which is how it became conscious in the first place.
Space was invented by that consciousness, by creating a rule-set of math/logic. Math/logic comes before space and dimensions.


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:03 pm 
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I am trying to expand the possibilities of what hasn't been proposed. Maybe try to add to the theory or expand some peoples minds. Maybe contribute something by discussing this possibility instead of dismissing it.

As it comes from the void where there is no direction no-thing no state and no rules just potential for everything, it explores ALL states ALL directions ALL dimensions as it is the nature of evolution to explore all possibilities, as there where no rules and no constraints to the directions it could take it is highly likely that it explored ALL. I find it hard to believe it just explored 2-dimensions. To me it is the most logical and natural result that the cells evolved to higher dimensions. While the LCS chooses a simple route to create us in this VR and others, however the LCS had to go through all complexities of evolution. It started simple and it evolved into a complex system like all things do.

The information system is not 2-D rather a complex high dimensional computer which would make it possible to compute all VR. I will let this be my theory, as information we receive is in all directions. It is also logical because it is possible and expressed in mathematics as something that could exist unlike infinity. The maths show it is possible.

Because our minds are conditioned to PMR 3-d experience and below the only possible interpretation we imagine is a 2d or 3d states, our minds can only describe it in such terms. Our minds are limited to these possibilites I assume AUO was not. While we may know that it explored higher dimensions we do not the geometry of it (spheres cubes or tetrahedrons).


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 5:06 pm 
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BlankMind wrote: Wed May 16, 2018 3:22 pm Beyond concepts such as space, cells etc., and at the end of the chain of "what is that made of? and what is that made of? and what is that made of?", you reach the fractal of existence. This is the foundation. The fractal is self-defined and evolves by continually defining itself, which is how it became conscious in the first place.
Space was invented by that consciousness, by creating a rule-set of math/logic. Math/logic comes before space and dimensions.
At the end everything is made of no-thing, nothingness, as it all comes from the void. Consciousness is no-thing in itself as it can't be defined as such a thing as it knows no boundaries and is in everything.


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PostPosted: Wed May 16, 2018 6:08 pm 
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There are three stages to the vision of Indra's Net. The first being the Void, Emptiness at its most complete.

Then there is the Void filled with reality cells and random data which is understood to be just about to start the interaction of the data within the cells. There is no other aspect to this as Consciousness has not come into existence or even 'dim awareness' or anything. Also there is no difference between any time increment of the LCS, from the first to the future.

Finally there is Indra's Net with the Jewels of Consciousness and their mutual reflections. There is no further change in this metaphor. There is no difference between the vision of The One Consciousness versus AUO versus AUM nor TBC or any other concept you wish to think of envisioning.

Ted


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