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PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 7:13 am 
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covertbabo wrote:As much as I like and appreciate smart people,
I believe that ideas must also have application in real everyday life.


An example of what I mean by pratical usage :

Let's say person XYZ is exerting effort to become rich, so he can afford Lamborghinis and so on.

Then you come and tell him: "Look, this is only virtual reality.
"So I'll save you a lot of time: Just go lie down and meditate, and you will find yourself transported to another reality. Then → you can have fun with richez over there, because that world is just as real as this one."


See, that would be an example of some practical benefits of the Toe; but -- I don't think the above is possible. Because: the real world and real cash will most likely override and trump the importance of any other Reality-frame™ that you can arrive to by meditation.
this brings to mind the Jim Carrey quote "everyone should get rich and famous, so that they can understand that that is not the answer"

if someone is basically happy, they are likely on a profitable path (profitable, from a consciousness point of view). Getting off path, normally leads to negative feedback, on some level.

they will either fail in acheiving the Lambourgini or they will succeed, and PMR is constructed such that either outcome is educational,nd moves the project forward.

You shouldn't be trying to convert that other guy anyways, unless it is some sort of Sopranos scenario where the guy is questioning his lifestyle and is searching for answers.

MBTOE is not necessarily about meditation. Thats just one suggestion Tom makes based on the observation that pretty much all religions and consciousness enhancement systems promote this, and his direct experience. He was a TM guy pre-Monroe.

The core concept is rather to become aware that you are moving through a decision tree, pretty much every moment of your life, and that your decisions have consequences. If you are basically comfortable, materially and emotionally, you are probably pretty good at this. If you are basically uncomfortable, that is likely why you are here looking to expand your decision space.

Personally, beyond MBTOE, I see ways that FWAUs create discomfort beyond Tom's specific issue of NPMR negative feedback (sort of like negative Karma). You may be abusing your DNA hardware in some way, or you may be abusing your practical life in some way, attracting negative feedback on the physical or practical levels. After doing some cleanup in these regards, your NPMR feedback might come through with less noise.

Regarding physical and practical life, Tom goes into sex and diet and deconstructs the notion of "dropping out" from society. Its not what you do, its how you do it. So yes, you can be a missal defence analyst, and be low entropy.

Personally, I think most spiritual nomads are so confused regarding their physical and practical lives (as I was), they don't know which way is up, and NPMR feedback is the least of their problems. Which is why I talk a lot about reconnecting with nature and your nature (anthropological correctness), and reconnecting with the capitalist system and your long term financial planning.

You then layer in doing that crap ethically, which introduces a profitable constraint...put all that together, bake for 30 minutes, and you yield a joyous life, in harmony with your hardware, firmware and software, optimized and working together.

You may or may not be driving a Lambourgini. Depends on your motivation. A self made billionaire might donate 95% of their wealth to useful other-centered projects, and reward themselves with such a car, because it is an object of beauty. Owning such a car to impress others, would be a less profitable motivation.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 3:11 pm 
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Hi covertbabo and welcome to Tom's MBT discussion forums. A larger understanding about the nature of Reality is an everyday application as it allows the choices we and other make to be better understood. While we only need be concerned with manipulating our own choices in most cases we can still use this larger understanding to see that most people are doing the best they can with what they have to work with. That is useful in reducing stress I think.

Welcome again.
Love to you and yours,
Bette

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 4:44 pm 
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As with any other information, it depends on what you do with it. It CAN help you to gain wisdom, resolve problems, find purpose, happiness, serenity, get over yourself, find yourself, lose bad habits, etc.

Some people don't do anything with it and, for them, it has no practical application.

If you read through some of the posts on the boards, you will find some examples of what people have done with it.

Personally, I have used it and gotten all sorts of benefits which have helped me to become a more effective person, get along better with others, deal with life better, and get lots of answers to questions that have been on my mind. Most importantly, it helped me to get over a bit of road rage.


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PostPosted: Thu Mar 15, 2012 7:11 pm 
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covertbabo wrote:As much as I like and appreciate smart people,
I believe that ideas must also have application in real everyday life.


An example of what I mean by pratical usage :

Let's say person XYZ is exerting effort to become rich, so he can afford Lamborghinis and so on.

Then you come and tell him: "Look, this is only virtual reality.
"So I'll save you a lot of time: Just go lie down and meditate, and you will find yourself transported to another reality. Then → you can have fun with richez over there, because that world is just as real as this one."


See, that would be an example of some practical benefits of the Toe; but -- I don't think the above is possible. Because: the real world and real cash will most likely override and trump the importance of any other Reality-frame™ that you can arrive to by meditation.
The core of the MBT theory is about application:

Honest Introspection - looking at our own motivations and intent honestly.
Letting go of fear and ego.
Practicing open-minded skepticism.
Accepting uncertainty.
Do the best that we can with what we have.
Find out for yourself - your truth must come from your experience.

These are some of the key foundational messages in MBT and in Tom's lectures (as I interpret it).

Most of us can agree (based on our own experiences and by observing those around us) that doing the opposite of any of the things listed above typically leads to negative long-term results. These are the ideas that apply to our everyday lives.

These are the things that lead to Truth by default. The good news is that if we choose to ignore these concepts or cannot grasp them, then the direct feedback of PMR will eventually point us in the right direction. That is part of the process.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 7:38 am 
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"Before enlightenment,pump gas drive lamborghini,after enlightenment, pump gas drive lamborghini"-Bhudda...I think.

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 8:02 am 
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there are two very distinct ways to pump gas

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PostPosted: Thu Mar 22, 2012 8:25 am 
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Good shot, Simba.

I think it is such a universal Zen aphorism that there is really no attribution.

Before enlightenment, chop wood, carry water. After enlightenment, chop wood, carry water.

The Buddha is given as the source of
"I obtained absolutely nothing from unexcelled complete awakening."
as I provides you with absolutely no chopped firewood nor water in your pail.

You must still interact within the world as before. With however a better sense of how and why.

Ted


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:29 am 
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Sorry if I reiterate something that has been said earlier in this topic. The everyday application of a given knowledge I think resides partly in the knower and not wholly in the knowledge "alone". A knowledge, as an entity, seeks to be "known", as this is the natural way it can represent and submit to its own function in a reality fabric. A question like "what is the everyday usage of My Big TOE" seems to me like a question "what is the everyday usage if I can drive a car". These everyday usages are reality-entities and "sub-systems" that are evolving on their own in a host-environment like an individual mind, and no doubt your question is quite efficient at drawing attention to this notion. My opinion only, and hope it contains some elements you find useful.
Ted Vollers wrote:Good shot, Simba.

I think it is such a universal Zen aphorism that there is really no attribution.

Before enlightenment, chop wood, carry water. After enlightenment, chop wood, carry water.

The Buddha is given as the source of
"I obtained absolutely nothing from unexcelled complete awakening."
as I provides you with absolutely no chopped firewood nor water in your pail.

You must still interact within the world as before. With however a better sense of how and why.

Ted
Hello Ted,

sorry to approach this directly, but I'm soooooo curious. I just recently realized that you are "THAT" Ted I've read the Reality Theory and watched many many videos of. It is very nice to see that you are the prime admin on these boards. And here is my question : do you consider yourself an enlightened person? If the question is way too personal, then please answer all the more! :D


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 4:09 am 
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Gyz,

You have me confused with someone else. Tom has two videos of me on his Youtube channel (and copied elsewhere) and if you are watching many, it must be someone else. That picture of me is pretty much what I look like, just gone through a conversion to lines. What is the Reality Theory you refer to? Can you post links to these things so we can perhaps identify them?

Ted


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 9:20 am 
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Uhm, I thought you were the www.active-mysticism.com Ted.


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 11:14 am 
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Yes, that is me. However you confused the issue with mentioning "watched many many videos" as there are but two. Nor do I understand what you mean by "Reality Theory". Do you mean what I called my Short Model of Reality? And I have written a couple of 'chapters' working towards a book that will likely never happen and instead it will all go into or has already gone into the Wiki instead. Tom had me post them on the Bulletin Board and they are now merged into the model and other things on the Wiki.

The more that I know, the more that there obviously is to know and understand. If you know my web site, you know that my understanding has gone through many stages over the decades, not exactly equivalent or valuable, but all legitimate envisionments of this VR of PMR. The concept of Enlightenment fades away into the fact that all words are only defined by other words, originally rising from the Void. Enlightenment is a concept coming from a particular belief system. Reality is much bigger, as AUM and the Larger Consciousness System, than any words or concepts created here in PMR and with PMR languages can describe. Tom's model of reality is the most complete that I know and Tom and I both know that it is not complete and will grow more complete and detailed with time and has done so since Tom first described it in his My Big TOE.

Ted


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 1:03 pm 
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Yes, I've meant your Short Model of Reality, sorry for not being precise with the title.

YouTube now indeed shows a tamer selection of videos relating to you. I recall there was another one a while ago in which you talked in a social environment, unfortunately it was a noisy one with all the background chit-chat.

Thank you for your thorough reply. Your thoughts are very clear and precise. What do you mean by saying that the theory already has evolved? As result of these boards, maybe, or, is there another relevant paradigm that has been incorporated into the model? Well, I suppose it evolves with each second, does it not?


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:10 pm 
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Tom' model as written up in the Wiki is condensed into a few pages versus being spread throughout his books. Furthermore, there has been the addition of the concept of the Virtual Reality Rendering Engine which Tom has found useful as a clarification of the role of The Big Computer in generating the experience of the Virtual Reality in PMR versus NPMR. It also more explicitly shows the effect of fractals in the generation of the experience of the VR. There were implications of the nature of Consciousness Space as being describable as a Cellular Automaton in the book, but it was not explicitly spelled out. The concept of a meta reality and its relationship to free will is more clearly spelled out. There are other odds and ends and particularly how changes in the development of the LCS resulting in what eventually became IUOCs and the RWW were related to aspects of pure mathematics. This was discussed over some time by Tom and I. Then as the Wiki was created, I took my accumulated notes and writings and Tom's commentaries and wrote up the model as it is on the Wiki. There has never been anything new added in the sense that Tom has not pointed out that it was already inherent within the description in his books, but it is now more explicitly stated. It is intended to be a reference to anyone wishing to apply the model to PMR science as opposed to a general write up for those new to the concepts and not 'scientists' but more general readers. In a sense, these things are 'new' to the model but in another sense, as inherent to Tom's understanding but not explicit in his books, there is nothing really new. View it as you will personally as new elements or not.

Ted


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PostPosted: Fri Apr 06, 2012 2:57 pm 
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Thank you for your time and the info, Ted.


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