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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:27 pm 
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I was not going to vote in 2008. I did not like both candidates, and I don't lake an idea to vote against, instead of to vote for someone. Back than my son was still living in Pittsburgh, and he and my husband used different kind of arguments to change my mind. Finally I gave up, and voted for Obama. It means, I didn't vote for Obama, but voted against McCain. Our president may be a nice and well educated person, but he is a very poor president. I really regret, that Hillary was not elected. In my opinion we would have a much better picture now. Republicans hate her even more, or as much, as they hate a current president. So, i am not sure, who could or would be a good president. Maybe, could be and would be do not work here. But I know a feeling, when I voted against, and i don't like it.

When Iraqi war was declared, I told my husband, that it is going to be another Vietnam, only longer. He said, that I don't read news papers, don't listen to the radio, how could I know what is going to happen?  I was right, and I am not happy about it. Iraqi and Afghanistan wars became the silent wars now. 

We always will have plenty of weather news, believe me. Here goes my old stance. I lived in UUSR, and classical music and weather are always there for you, as a great distraction. Weather is a great fear inducer. Almost all old ladies watch weather channel. Earth is shaking, hurricanes are washing towns and cities off the land, tornadoes are leveling off and destroying what hurricanes have left untouched on a ground, and floods and fires are covering a half of this country on a daily basis. This is your hourly news on a national weather channel. You don't need to watch Hitchcock, his movies less scary, than weather on your backyard. 

If this is time for changes, they will come anyway. Changes were greatly postponed in seventies. Or history took another turn. I can see, that spiritual (for the lack of better word) awareness is on a rise. Apparently it needs a strong boost and challenge.  We choose to live at this time. May be we knew something, and wanted to be challenged? What is good or bad for us can be understood only from a big picture perspective, or on a long run.

Lena

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PostPosted: Fri Sep 09, 2011 8:52 pm 
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Decades ago I concluded that the rules of politics and what they believed in were as follows:

1) Get Elected.

2) See Rule number 1.

3) There are no more rules to politics.

I will pit myself as a grumpy old man against your grumpiness any day. I am not certain which I count the lowest, lawyers or politicians but it makes little difference as so many lawyers are politicians. Pettifogging shysters the lot of them. Now I have decided that ideologues are worse than either. A politician may sell out his mother, father, sister or brother for cash money. But an ideologue will sell out the country and even the world for his or her little, limited belief system.

Ted


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 6:26 am 
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Beau wrote:It isn't about raising taxes. It's about correcting the idiotic move of EVER lowering taxes on the richest of the rich. They don't pay their share and most of them know it and are willing to pay more, but the corporations that would be effected are blocking the much needed procedure to reinstate the proper taxes for them. The Koch bros. can be heartily thanked for that and they would love nothing more than a nation of brown shirts.
This is very topical here in the UK at present. There is talk of lowering the top rate of income tax, which is 50% for those earning above £150K ($240K) pa, brought in by the previous Labour govt. It is claimed this will jeopardise the financial recovery by deterring the wealthy from living here, and thus depriving us of their 'abilities'. In fact, not a few of these super-rich have stated they are quite happy to pay this rate, which is a potential sign of progress, but, whether or not the rate gets changed, it seems as a culture we still pander to personal greed and selfish instincts first. I understand the top tax rate in the US is only 35%!

As already pointed out in this thread, all this represents our current mean (both senses) level of consciousness. PMR as it is. It's changing slowly, but the road is long.

Arthur

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Last edited by Arthur on Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:31 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 8:37 am 
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The most wealthy there in Britain are probably happier to pay those high rates because they get a return for them. The society provides more services to the lower incomes and thus the environment is made safer for those in the highest income brackets so they can feel safe living in the country. To the extent that the lowest income stratas are feeling deprived or either opportunity or decent living conditions, as was the apparent cause of recent riots there, the environment degrades and the rich are more likely to bail out and live abroad. Britain needs some rebalancing of these relative levels and perceptions apparently just as the US needs some major rebalancing of the situation here.

The lower strata here in the US are now being manipulated more by the media, owned by the very most rich minority stratum, and receive a great deal less in social services. The right wing putsch is on here to cut social services even more, and possibly even totally, in the name of the ideology of less but more controlling government and minimal taxes to the advantage of the rich. The rich have many other places to live and the big and very rich corporations have world wide operations so they can move wealth around and production around almost at will to maximize income and minimize costs. Perhaps when the US is reduced to third world status, they will allow us to engage in production again because our wages will be as low as those in the other third world countries. Meanwhile as long as there is still some wealth to be stolen here, they will be taking it from those who still have a little to fatten the profits of the biggest corporations and richest owners of America. Fights are being manipulated between the relatively well off but not at all rich and those below them as part of the manipulation to keep taxes off of the very rich.

Ted


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:19 am 
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Pew Research Center, Obama Leadership Image Takes a Hit, GOP Ratings Decline Continued Dissatisfaction with Republican Field
http://people-press.org/2011/08/25/obam ... s-decline/ This is a very long article.
Overview

The public is profoundly discontented with conditions in the country, its government, political leadership and several of its major institutions. Fully 79% are dissatisfied with the way things are going in the country. Even more (86%) say they are frustrated or angry with the federal government. Favorable ratings for both political parties are in negative territory and have declined since the beginning of the year. Just 22% approve of the job performance of Republican congressional leaders, down from 36% in February. Ratings for Democratic leaders are only somewhat better (29% approve). More generally, the Republican Party’s favorable rating has declined from 43% in early February to 34% currently. At 43%, the Democratic Party is viewed more favorably than the GOP, but it too was rated a bit better earlier in the year (47% in February).
Lena

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:26 am 
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Thanks for the link, Lena.

I view this sort of survey work as a sort of guided tour narrative on the 'tour bus' of the school campus.

I'm back out looking for a job after a temp assignment ended, so would generally be one of the 'discontented' if I were to respond to such a survey.


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 9:59 am 
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RBM wrote:I'm back out looking for a job after a temp assignment ended
While I started working at 14, and have been on the job search before, I am very lucky that I have been able to stay home with my son because we still have help for the deserving poor (my son). I am sort of psychologically effected by this too though as I haven't had to deal with that Reality, and wouldn't do well in it anymore. My daughter who is working in housekeeping at a hotel here is learning the ropes though and I can live it vicariously through her as usual. She doesn't take any $hit and I feel responsible but so far it has worked in her favor. She is very observant of inequality and unfairness.

Good luck RBM. :)
Love
Bette

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 10:27 am 
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Very good find Lena. With that much more information things don't look quite as bad as before. Clearly there is some catching on that the Tea Baggers are to be shunned and the regular politicians had better realize that they better get back to regular politics and the country's business or the people will throw all the rascals out. That at least is my general take on it. President Obama needs to emulate Harry Truman and take it to the American people direct.

Ted


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 10:53 am 
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50% income tax in the U.K. if you make over 150k? WOW! That's a lot.


Last edited by Lumpy on Sat Sep 10, 2011 10:59 am, edited 1 time in total.

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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 10:53 am 
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http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1plSSL2v ... ideo_title

Despotism as defined by this short film from 1946 exactly matches the A.L.E.C. - Koch Bros. - Neocon - Teabagger agenda....

The 14 signs of fascism:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G93Dw_1b ... re=related


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:06 am 
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Here's another. Naomi Wolfe presents a level-headed and very human (I mean that in a good way) case warning about American fascism.

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RjALf12PAWc


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 11:55 am 
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Moving on to a bigger picture, note that DARPA means to engage in a 'meme' war:

http://www.blacklistednews.com/DARPA_Pr ... 8/Y/M.html

You know, just the other day, on coast to coast am, they had a fellow on for an hour who had written a graduate thesis arguing that people that believe that there was a conspiracy involving the Kennedy assassination were more likely to believe that there was a conspiracy involving 9-11. The general tone of the thing was to indicate that 'believing that conspiracies are likely is a state of mind', not said but implied: of a less than ideal nature.

Establishing the credibility of such a notion in the public mind is a fine example of the subtle and pernicious nature of war of ideas being waged. Seen outside the belief system that it means to help establish, the argument is pure bullshit.

Same essential argument:

"If you kick a guy in the face once and he objects, there is an increased chance that he will object if you do it a second time."

...Duh~

The message here is that you really have to watch the information that gets floated to the public. Even 30 years ago, I recall skimming a book by a PR fellow that then declared that most of what you hear in the mainstream news is PR produced.

-Montana


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:13 pm 
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Very true Montana. The pentagon and Government actually spends our tax money running it's press releases through PR firms....

http://www.reclaimthemedia.org/propagan ... eed_ou2535

The 'Rendon Group' is one such firm. One would think people would be outraged by this; but.....


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:22 pm 
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So based upon my comments here about our friendly people in charge, I might some dark night finding a group of big, armed men at my door with an invitation to come spend some time talking to our dear uncle, explaining why I don't love them any more?

Ted


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PostPosted: Sat Sep 10, 2011 12:30 pm 
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Lumpy wrote:50% income tax in the U.K. if you make over 150k? WOW! That's a lot.
52% top rate in the Netherlands, apparently http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/business-14810323

At 35%, your US fat cats have it easy over there!

Arthur

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